Hello Bo Miao,

I don't understand the specific physical system that you presented, but remember that entropy increase refers to the system + surroundings; not just the system alone that someone may be focusing their attention on. So if you have energy input into your system, your system is by definition not isolated; and you must consider the surroundings that include the entropy change needed to produce this input energy.

Hello James C. Trask，

It is evident that the second law of thermodynamics greatly misleads scientists. I don't want to explain. You can view the phenomenon I am describing from a physics perspective.

Dear Bo Miao ,

Please share the calculations and/or measurements you have conducted to understand your reasoning, as the information you have provided is not sufficient to fully comprehend your argument.

Thank you for your attention and interest. My goal is to encourage everyone to use basic physics and logic methods to study thermodynamics. Similarly, supporters of the second law of thermodynamics can provide detailed explanations. The second law of thermodynamics is a conjecture based on finite experience. The mistake is very basic and goes against common sense. The pursuit of science is logical, empirical, and mathematical.

Galileo explained the errors of Aristotle's theory of falling bodies in just a few words, and now it's time for the second law of thermodynamics. I believe in overturning the second law with the least amount of language. The Second Law and Aristotle's theory of falling bodies are both relatively low empirical understandings with numerous problems. You can refer to the first post on the topic for details.

I’ve been following this discussion (missing some parts) but I am still looking for your goal. As you have decided to rule out the importance of the second law, (i) you should point out what you are proposing as a replacement for the second law, and (ii) in astrophysics (also in systems with few particles) we may have negative specific heat (without violation of the second law) and entropy can decrease (local). The system is the whole universe. In the microcanonical view, we consider the universe as an isolated system. So, what would be the balance in energy for this system, ruling out the second law?

Use free energy instead of entropy to determine thermodynamic direction, and calculate thermal work conversion using the first law of thermodynamics.

Your answer is quit intriguing. you suggest to write down the thermodynamic fundamental equations as E(T) and T(E)? or, is this in your account, irrelevant?

regards

Dear Bo Miao ,

While science must remain open to any argument (no matter how absurd it may seem), it is true that Galileo refuted Aristotle's theory of of falling bodies, he did not do so with just "a few words". Instead, he conducted multiple experiments to demonstrate that objects fall with the same acceleration—a principle that has been verified countless times from then until today, including experiments conducted in space. Following your goal of "in a few words," you are asserting that heat can transfer from cold objects to hot objects without experimental evidence, without theoretical justification...Therefore, do you expect to refute the Second Law of Thermodynamics based on...?

The deviation rate between the second law of thermodynamics and experiments is 15% to 25%.

A: Perform polynomial fitting on experimental data of the second virial coefficient of the high-precision state equation, and then calculate the second virial coefficient of sound velocity using the second law of thermodynamics. Compare with experiments. Cases with significant search bias. Experiment and mathematics are better, don't have technical explanations. Write specific examples without using NIST data.

B:Example 1: Propane

In an experiment focused on propane, a set of high - precision data regarding the second virial coefficient of the state equation was obtained within a temperature range of 200 - 500K. These data were then subjected to polynomial fitting. The experimental setup was designed to accurately measure the properties of propane under varying conditions. After the polynomial fitting of the second virial coefficient data, the second law of thermodynamics was applied to calculate the second virial coefficient of sound velocity.

When the calculated values were compared with the experimental values of the second virial coefficient of sound velocity, significant deviations were observed. In the temperature range of 293.48K - 323.19K, the deviation rate was found to be between 15% - 18%. For instance, at 293.48K, the calculated value of the second virial coefficient of sound velocity was - 200.9 (cm^3/mol), while the experimental value was - 245.1 (cm^3/mol), resulting in a deviation rate of 18%.

Example 2: A Mixture of Gases (Hypothetical Mixture for Illustration)

Consider a mixture of two gases, Gas A and Gas B. High - precision experiments were carried out to measure the second virial coefficient of the state equation for this mixture over a temperature span of 300 - 400K. The data collected was carefully analyzed and polynomial fitting was performed. The complexity of the mixture added an extra layer of challenge to the experiment, as the interactions between the two different gas molecules needed to be accounted for.

Subsequently, calculations were made using the second law of thermodynamics to determine the second virial coefficient of sound velocity. When compared with the experimental results, large deviations were noted. In particular, at around 350K, the calculated value deviated from the experimental value by approximately 25%. This significant deviation could potentially be attributed to the complex intermolecular forces within the gas mixture, which were not fully captured by the theoretical model used in the calculation based on the second law of thermodynamics.

Just two minor comments:

- Both Galileo and Aristotle were right: two objects with the same size and different masses fall with the same acceleration in vacuum, but fall with different acceleration when not in vacuum (the buoyancy force makes the difference, so no paradox).

- The suggestion for "Using free energy instead of entropy to determine thermodynamic direction" is just what the Thermodynamics' second law concludes for a system in equilibrium with a thermal reservoir (environment): the variation of the Gibbs energy of the system coincides with the variation of the total (system plus environment) entropy with opposite sign.

ΔST = ΔSe + ΔS = –ΔH/T + ΔS = –(ΔH – TΔS)/T = –ΔG/T

or ΔG = –TΔST