There must be hundreds or thousands of works dealing with lab experiments for sediment transport problems, but who cares if they are not available as raw data (and downloaded files) that can be used by the rest of the research community? Not very useful if not.
What I do search are simple test cases, simple benchmarking problems that can serve to validate sediment transport models, that have their data (web download for example) available for the modeller community, as is common practice in Tsunami Modelling.
I have found some many works as, for example:
- Naqshband et al (2014) JGR Earth Surface, 119:1043-1063, but I can just perform a qualitative comparison, as I do not have access to the raw data and only print paper information coming from figures is available (not a very objective way of comparing).
And same comment for the rest of the works, as those coming from SAND PIT project (with a web page not accesible any more), as for example:
- Klein, A. (2004). Validation of morphodynamic models on channels, trenches and pits.
- van Rijn and Walstra (2003). Modelling of sand transport in DELFT3D
- de Groot (2005). Modelling the morphological behaviour of sandpits
Summarising, I look for laboratory experiment data for sediment transport validation/benchmarking that can be downloaded and used for comparison purposes.
Hola Jorge,
As you may know collecting data is a hard process and experimentalist tend to be a bit jealous of their data. However, there is a new movement to be more open and share the raw and processes data.
You can find information in all possible networks...
Blog: sedimentexperiments.blogspot.com
Twitter: @sedimentexp
Contact: [email protected]
Intro video: EarthCubeNSF YouTube
Article: Building a Sediment Experimentalist Network (SEN), Dec 2013 Sedimentary Record
Newsletter: subscribe to our ~monthly newsletter
I was involved in sediment transport a long time ago (1965-1970): labelling sediments with radioactive elements (198Au, 51Cr, 46Sc). This labelling method was used both in the field and in laboratory experiment such as by "Laboratoire Central d'Hydraulique de France" (LCHF). I remember of experiments in the field using radioactive tracers and experiment models on the same specific subject. As far as I know, LCHF is now under EDF. here is a possible connection: http://chercheurs.edf.com/fichiers/fckeditor/Commun/Innovation/departements/DOC_EDF_PLAQUETTE_LNHE_Fr.pdf.pdf
If you can get in touch of them, I am sure that you can get some information.
Hola Mauricio,
I do fully agree with you and I also know well, and had suffered, the difficulty of getting observed or experimental data. But this "my data mentality" should change and evolve to a "let´s share" mindset. In this way, scientific progress should move forward faster and be more productive with the same funding.
I am impressed by the links and the YouTube video you sent. Thanks a lot. It is an amazing initiative I did not know. Great piece of information!!!
Very good question and idea.
Two problems exist:
1. All of the raw data have same errors. So authors afraid false interpretation of data by people who don’t now in details the conditions of the experiments.
2. The experiments spend money of Institutes, Universities or other Organizations. So raw data have the cost. Due to this it is very difficult to find the person in the Organization who give you the official permission to publish it for free. Everybody afraid it due to absence of clear regulations in this direction.
I absolutely agree with you, but I would add:
To overcome problem 1, the solution would be to clearly define benchmark problems specifying how to compare with observations. So no misunderstanding, no false interpretation.
For point 2, if we want go further the scientific advance, we should share and collaborate, mainly because at the end all of us are paying for that research: the funding of the project I lead comes from the national or regional government or the EU. Therefore is paid by all of us. I should get observed data or experimental data, used them, writing my paper and sometime later (5 years, to say something) be obliged to share that data and the users to cite the source. For example.
Ferdinand, is amazing what you say!!! and a good reason not to share "your data"...
I would like to see here in Spain (and all around the world) what it seems to be a reality in Germany, I did not know it was like that, but give me one more argument when arguing about this matter.
I did not find the reference you mention, but I found two others of my interest.
Thanks
Dear colleagues,
Alain RECKING initially gathered a large dataset from previous experiments and his own flume tests.
You can find a table of 1532 values of solid transport measurments in the appendix of his PhD manusprit available at the end of his webpage: https://sites.google.com/site/pagepersoalainrecking/encadrement
The following parameters are available in the dataset of his PhD:
"Notations:
Column 1 [N°] : Run number
Column 2 [ID] : Run number in the original source
Column 3 [Author] : Author
Column 4 [W] : Flume width (m)
Column 5 [D] : Grain diameter (mm)
Column 6 [s] : Sediment geometric standard deviation defined in Brownlie by s =0.5(D84/D50+D50/D16) and by D90/D30 in MPM, Smart,Rickenmann, and by D84/D16 in Cao
Column 7 [rs] : Mass density of sediment (Kg/m3)
Column 8 [r] : Mass density of water (Kg/m3)
Column 9 [So] : Geometric slope
Column 10 [Q] : Flow discharge (m3/s)
Column 11 [U] : Mean flow velocity (m/s)
Column 12 [R/D] : Relative depth (corrected for side wall effects)
Column 13 [U/u*c]: Friction value expressed in the Darcy-Weisbach form 8/ f
Column 14 [H] : Flow depth (m)
Column 15 [H/W] : Ratio flow depth to flume width
Column 16 [Fr] : Froude number Fr=U/(gH)0.5
Column 17 [Re] : Reynolds number Re=UR/n (R corrected for side wall effects)
Column 18 [Re*] : Roughness Reynolds number Re*=u*D/n
Column 19 [C] : Sediment concentration in ppm (g/m3)
Column 20 [q] : Shields parameter q=RS0/[D(s-1)]
Column 21 [F] : Non-dimensional solid discharge F=qsv/[g(s-1)D3]0.5
The Vanoni and Brooks side wall correction was used for the entire data set (knowing W, D,S0, Q, U) to be coherent."
He subsequently proposed a formula calibrated on a double dataset gathering field data for low solid discharges and flume data for high solid discharges (Recking, A. Simple method for calculating reach-averaged bed-load transport Journal of Hydraulic Engineering, 2013, 139, 70-75 details on the field data measurments are available in the paper, it seems also possible to download the dataset), .
I hope it could help you in testing your works and models.
Best regards,
Guillaume
https://sites.google.com/site/pagepersoalainrecking/encadrement
https://drive.google.com/viewerng/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxwYWdlcGVyc29hbGFpbnJlY2tpbmd8Z3g6MzNiZTcyYWY1NjAzZTYyNA
Thank you, Guillaume, for your extremely useful (and detailed) piece of information. Let's have a look to all that.
Dear Jorge,
Did you find the data you were looking for?. I just came across this question in RG.
I guess it depends on the experiments you are looking for. For my thesis we carried out controlled lab benchmark tests to study the morphodynamic evolution of a submerged and surface piercing sand dune, to be used to calibrate/validate numerical models. No sediment transport measurements as such but the hydrodynamic conditions (during) and bathymetry of the tests at defined intervals.
Let me know if you are interested.
Best wishes,
Isabel
Dear Jorge,
Did you find the data you were looking for?. I just came across this question in RG.
I guess it depends on the experiments you are looking for. For my thesis we carried out controlled lab benchmark tests to study the morphodynamic evolution of a submerged and surface piercing sand dune, to be used to calibrate/validate numerical models. No sediment transport measurements as such but the hydrodynamic conditions (during) and bathymetry of the tests at defined intervals.
Let me know if you are interested.
Best wishes,
Isabel
Hi Isabel, I did not see your answer till today (do not know why) but I am really interested in your work and having a look to your thesis. Thanks!
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