India triumphed in its first interplanetary mission, placing a satellite into orbit around Mars on Wednesday and catapulting the country into an elite club of deep-space explorers. India's maiden mission to Mars, the Mangalyaan, has arrived in orbit after a 300-day marathon covering over 670 million kilometres (420 million miles). It cost India a total of about $75 million compared to NASA’s much larger Maven mission cost nearly 10 times as much, at $671 million. Should this be a priority for a developing country such as India? Please share your thoughts. Thanks in advance.
http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-28268186
Thanks Shanmuga for your response. I have the same feeling and there should be some kind of a dialog among people as to the priorities for different segments in the society for the benefit of the people. Any effort spent on advanced technologies always provides a lot off spin off technologies that will be used in other sectors of interest to large number of people. This type of mission can provide a boost to defense technologies such as ICBM and IRBM as the technologies can be readily used there.
I am afraid perhaps this discussion may become India centric, but any way we must discuss it purely from scientific and technological points of view . My thoughts are as follows
(i) If one has talents and capabilities, one must show and must be visible.
(ii) It creates scientific culture and gives moral boost.
(iii) Money spent is not huge if you compare with some of the scams (coalgate, G2 and others).
(iv) In many missions developed and applied by the Indian government for the welfare of the society, more than 60% money go to the pockets of the Politicians and no one is accountable. Here money is well spent .
(v) The developed technology can be used for the welfare of society.
I believe there there is a useful purpose served by such interplanetary missions for mankind, if not now, there will be in future.
"The limiting factor on science for most planetary orbiters is not the time the instruments can make observations. Rather it is the time available to return data to Earth because many instruments can gather data far faster than the communications system can transmit it to antennas on Earth. (There also are a limited number of antennas to listen to planetary spacecraft, so few missions receive continuous coverage, and spacecraft often cannot continuously transmit either because they must turn to observe the planet or the planet itself blocks communication.) "
For more information, ou may look at the following link:
http://futureplanets.blogspot.com/
I believe the usefulness of such missions is related to their potential in increasing our knowledge and understanding about the universe, its composition, state, workings...etc
We live in interesting times where the democratisation of knowledge and its widespread diffusion is slowly allowing a number of nations to develop key technologies to benefit their nations and the world. India, is one of the leading nations in the domain of technology acquisition.
$75 million is nothing to be paid by a great country like India. actually this great success will bring much more fund to Indian space research.
India has many problems regarding the number of people living there, but they are walking steady for a greater life and country.
Congratulations India.
I think, a country exists in a context; and needs to spend money and resources on scientific investigations. This will enhance the self-esteem of a developing nation, that helps build its tempo for working hard for realizing its vision. The rise in the image of the country in the comity of nations is also essential for geo-political reasons for any country. We also hope that the development can be put to use that eventually helps common people as well.
Always search and discovery is an innate spirit of humans. The advancement of scientific and technological knowledge enable us to go deep in to the outer space to search for the unknown and study the formation and its properties of the greater universe. India's such extraordinaire successful landing on mars also indicates the capacity of all humans to do such accomplishments in establishing and utilizing scientific knowledge to do such advanced accomplishments.
It is not always the case that society makes advancements because of perfect social conditions, but because of its members desire to do their utmost intellectual curiosity to work more and go deeper and deeper on what we do however complicated the socio-political circumstances are.
That was how the new continents of the west were discovered (if it is the right word) and become among the most desired destinations of humanity today.
Who knows therefore, one day humans may do the same thing establishing a destination in deep space where humans can travel and establish life there for better.
I apologize if I go by the argument of the specificanswer for some general considerations.
We have all heard the flop of the last mission of NASA and the amount wasted. Probably many have wondered what they can now serve these expensive research that sometimes does not seem to bring anything useful.
It is said that the missions are generally unnecessary. In fact, some things that we use now are usually derived from these expensive space missions.
Some examples are the micro fiber, velcro, but many other usual applications have been studied and used in the space,
The exploration of space has mainly two, directions: 1) Scientific-technological and
2) Geo-political.
India gets profits from both directions. The independence and autonomy of a country has this feature: must be based on both, scientific-technological and geo-political.
I think the spend of money was worth it!
Dear @Nageswara, it is very big step for India, as it is a big step for a Indian scientists. Relatively small investments by large country such as India is, will contribute to a great development and improvement of new technologies related to different scientific fields.
The progress of knowledge and science can be certainly enhanced by several other endeavors and success. It is good that the U.S., Russia and Europe succeed in the exploration of the outer space. But it is also desirable and a fine achievement that other countries such as China and India active higher goals, too. All this favors mankind as a whole.
Said otherwise, it is never good that science be developed by only one actor, or two actors. We all should be proud of the Indian (and yes: the Chinese) state, governments, and scientists. All in all, humanity can find thus one more source for learning.
This is like the question: "Should we send more ships to the new world? Does this serve a purpose?" According to the original inhabitants of the new world, it served anything but a useful purpose. However, it probably did enable enormous changes that constitute the world we now have. How do you like the world we now have? Does this world make you want to find another world instead?
India´s international power has increased. This means that she has more suasory power in international circles. Therefore the success of her space mission has indeed had practical consequences for her. As to the benefits to all mankind through this space triumph, that of course remains to be seen. But the Indian contribution cannot be harmful! Should her space program be a priority? Only the Indians can best judge, not I, an American.
Hi Rao,
I would love to answer your question completely, however, it is going to take me an article of few pages long. ( I like space exploration related questions). Therefore I am going to make it short and brief as well as keeping in mind the limited economic support options that India has. Scott Russell gave you a good answer too. Of course for India, robotics is a way to go and it has to be done for practical reasons that brings scientific and economic pay off. For example, sun, lunar mapping and near orbit meteors observations provide some rewards in scientific and economic terms. However, planetary search in other stars provides only scientific pay off only and it is not practical (short term) to drive economy forward. Interplanetary missions are useful if mining for rare earth metals are feasible so that you can make profits from it. Furthermore, Dr. Hawking himself said that it is very dangerous for humankind invest itself on one planet (all eggs in one basket). Well, Mars is a good opportunity to start to spread life outside Earth. I would suggest you read lots of good books written by Dr. Zubrin. He has written extensively about why humankind should invest itself in pursuing colonization of Mars. As long as you will find economical rewards in interplanetary missions like Mars for example, and make every mission pay off financially, the long term project will sustain itself without relying on external funding (government etc.) to support each mission. In case of mission failure, you can always sell robotics technology innovation you have made to private enterprises to cover your loses.
@Scott
Let me paraphrase your question: Does this world make you want to LIVE IN another world instead? What about colonization of Mars, I mean the planned expedition? Personally, I don't see much controversy in the Indian mission but the one to Mars sounds a bit surreal to me. Anyone else feels the same?
@Nelson,
Absolutely agree with you. I don't feel moral to judge India. Acknowledging - yes, judging - no.
I congratulate India for its successful Mars mission. This is pride of India and also is a landmark progress. This success is a source of national pride for all Indians and especially Indian scientists. My especial congratulation to all Indian RGers for this remarkable achievement!
The developed technology can be used in other industries and I believe that the money is well spent. Moreover, this success can serve as a huge source of motivation for all Indians scientists.
Hi Adam, Your views and suggestions make a lot of sense and are quite appreciable. I agree with you even as I am not a specialist on the subject. Your quote of Hawking on the issue has also added further credibility of your views, which to me appear quite convincing.
noting is static and yes for better and sustainable future we should have information about solar system in this regard its necessary
Sure, dear Nageswara! At least we know more about the beauty and grandeur of the infinite and illimitable space out there!
If every parameter for Human exsitence is feasible (or customizable) to live in MARS is identified, then the sole purpose of procreation of a place of resettlement or species to be proceeded outside of our earthly confines, is possible.
It may be the way in which a new society is created, and like any person in any country or migrated to another country but to a PLANET...
Space Hypothesis being validated now.
opportunity can available any where....
This mission is also a best try for searching, Some new opportunity....
To advance science and knowledge should be a priority to every country as those are the long-term foundations for prosperity. Space exploration is also becoming a branch of economics (besides its very huge scienific significance).
In addition it is a considerable result, which was obtained at very low cost and it gives the people inspiration. The money spent on science is never wasted as usually not only the scientists are paid for their work, but also industrial suppliers and the rest of the economy will profit from research money (as the scientists and engineers normally don't hide the money under their pillow, but by all sorts of things).
So, to conclude: very well done India!
For any human invention there are some advantages and disadvantages. As a researcher I believe such achievements gives us motivation to dig deeper to bring innovations.
Here are a number of technologies that were developed as part of Indian Space program that are available or used commercially.
http://www.isro.gov.in/ttg/technologyoffers.html
http://www.isro.gov.in/ttg/spinoffs.html
Dear Nageswara,
Dear All,
Interplanetary missions themselves can be heroic and significantly scientific deeds in the history of science. Although, it is a bit strange to spend horrible amounts of money for such objectives when millions of people live in miserable conditions and there are no funds for environmental protection, education etc.
R. C. Mittal had a significant point.
Great question!
The inspiration of such successful missions is priceless!
Period!
India has 1200 million people. So what is the per capita amount spent? Just meagre.
What benefit the US got from the Appolo program? An accountant would probably calculated that the costs were much higherst than the benefits. But an accountant would not factor in the effect that program had on a whole generation of children. We cannot look at such scientific programs which make people dream bigger dreams as accountants. For a country like India, 75 millions is not a lot of money and this program will make Indian proud, in particular the children, and the future benefit of that way excided the short term scientific and economic benefits.
My first thought - Congrats India! My second one - more opportunities for research. My third - opportunities for more investments in Science and Tech for India. ;)
Yes, tomorrow the 'game' will be played 'up there' and all countries will try to catch a position, so, congratulations to India!
Congratulation India and Indian scientists for this successful achievement; each scientific and technological success could drive many successful achievements in industry, education, research... and could help the country's economic status for more jobs, products, services, technologies... hope that in parallel better social/political programs be possible for eradicating misery; a scientific success without social impact and development could be unconsidered or lost by the people themselves..; I think that any scientific and technological development should be accompanied by social, environmental and human development to let to the country (India or any other one) better advances and in the same time secure its findings and knowledge improvement
A MASS TRANSPORT FOR MARS
“Gen1” Enterprise could get to Mars in ninety days, to the Moon in three, and “could hop from planet to planet dropping off robotic probes of all sorts en masse – rovers, special-built planes, and satellites. Building a full-sized, ion-powered version of the Enterprise complete with 1G of gravity on board, could be done with current technology. This version of the Enterprise would be three things in one: a spaceship, a space station, and a spaceport. A thousand people can be on board at once – either as crew members or as adventurous visitors.
http://www.universetoday.com/95099/engineer-thinks-we-could-build-a-real-starship-enterprise-in-20-years/
There are numerous benefits including: Advancing technology, understanding the origins of the solar system, promoting science and science education...
Congratulations!
In my opinion interplanetary missions help to develop science, and science is a part of culture. So it is well for any country.
Interplanetary exploration is the only venture that has the potential to truly unify human kind. When we are ready to colonize our first planet, other than earth, I hope that every nation has a representative on the spacecraft to get us there.
Hungary is standing before ESA joining, so I am very oprimistic in the perspectives of space research and space industry activities. As a teacher on Eötvös University, Budapest, I have practice in space science education. We loan NASA lunar samples, and NIPR Antarctic meteorites. So space studies are fruithful for students in learning specific topics, planetary analoges, fruithful for iniciating new measuring technologies, fruithful is building informatics and robotocs into several technology systems and subsystems, helps synthetical view of pjanomena. If you are thinking always not only Earth, but to other palnets with different conditions (p, T, C, and other parameters) you will always find a more complex and multisided solution to a problem. So I acn congratulate scientists of India to orbiting Mars with tje new space probe and helping with enthusiasm and problem arising the students not only in India but all over the world.
First of all - CONGRATULATION to India ! I mean that similarly to US Apollo program, this success is great inspiration for your nation. The inspiration and enthusiasm is really a great power that "moves mountains". Inspired people will produce or create much more benefits for economy, culture, etc... Another point: Humans has to invest much more to space technology and space flight abilities. It is question of mankind survival. Any progress at this field is reducing the risk of future collision with deadly asteroid or comet. Astronomers has to localize the objects on collision trajectory as soon as possible and experts for space flights has to be able to deflect such an object from collision trajectory. We are almost helpless by now, but we really cannot ignore this "sad reality", we have to enhance our space flights abilities across the Solar system to much higher level. The time is now.
Good going, India. I agree there are useful purposes to interplanetary missions. It appears that we may be able to accomplish manned space travel to other planets and perhaps further. It appears to be necessary knowledge both for how we understand our own world and how we might migrate to others.
DREAM to COME TRUE
It has become a craze with people to venture and see the maximum possible in their active life span of living. Unlike earlier generations the surplus economic development has interested them to picnic into space. The recent Virgin Galactic crash investigators are a long way from finding the cause, ‘Feathering’ descent system was unlocked two seconds before SpaceShipTwo disintegrated, but what happened next is unclear, “How and why that happened is something we are definitely trying to understand,” .... SPACE is a MASSIVE WIDE PROPOSITION with a complex list of UNKNOWN VARIABLES.
All our current space researches are iterative and filling a lot on Factor of Safety (paded on the unknown variables) till the mission accomplishes a success.
There is nothing to rejoice when successful or feel bad in a failure, every thing is a learning in science
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/nov/03/virgin-galactic-crash-investigation-rules-nothing-out
I agree with Prof. Krishnan that in science nothing like success and failure. It is perpetual learning process. However, ISRO scientists must be congratulated for their accomplishment on account of cost, accuracy and control over the mission.
We have paid for the lauch of AiSAT on PSLV-C23 in 2014 (and BIRD, TET...). I am pretty shure that India is on a good way to make money with their space skills in future. And, as Modi mentioned, the Mars mission is cheaper than the movie "Gravity". This is a proof of efficency! I am convinced that this kind of buisiness is the right step forward for India.
This space program, like all space programs, is mostly usefull socially, symbolically, prestigiously. This is highly important fonction. Million of kids in school in India marvel at this high achievement, billion of people around the world recognizes technical excellence of the Indian engineers. All of that is very important.
Of course there is a purpose on basic research - even for underdeveloped countries. India is a proud for many other nations, indeed.
The most basic purpose is understanding, explaining. Utilitarianism and pragmatism seem to me not to be good advisers when dealing with knowledge. After all, the best condition for life to be is exactly knowing and understanding.
There is a logic that say ''of money would have saved, feed and give shelter to a significant number of people''. It seems very logical. Lets examine if it is so. What happen with the huge amount of money that was allocated to the NASA in the 1960's? Was it re-allocated to ''of money would have saved, feed and give shelter to a significant number of people'' Absolutely NOT. The world and country such as India do not lack money. What is money? Money does not come those that have money. MOney does not comes from gold. Money is simply created from nothing in order to allocate our labor. There is a limited amount of labor YES but look around, the labor force is not fully employed. Why not to create more money to employ it and do unecessary things, beautiful things such as space exploration? Because the world political financial elite want to totally control labor exclusively to feed the fat ass and to leave aside all the unemployed. There is no real scarcity, only a manufacture one.
It is absurd for a person to think of not spend in space research. The future of space communication depends on deep study of space research from ground as well as satellite based instrument. Can Prof Rao do away with Television and mobile phones both are outcome of SPACE RESEARCH .Satellite are needed for predicting weather .Agriculture, Defense. These depend largely on data gathered by remote sensing satellites.
I hesitate answering such silly questions .I thought RESEARH GATE sends only scientific questions.
R.G.Rastogi
The Ethics of Space Exploration edited by James S.J. Schwartz, Tony Milligan could be a good resource to explore on the matter.
Benefits Stemming from Space Exploration is a 2013 publication giving plenty of answers to the question asked. Please see the link below.
https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Benefits-Stemming-from-Space-Exploration-2013-TAGGED.pdf
If anybody is sceptic in connection with the perspectives of planetary and spece science, have a look at the soon coming conference at NASA about the proposals for the decades till 2050: (http://www.hou.usra.edu/meetings/V2050/program/).
With best regards: Szaniszlo Berczi
Telecommunications support is one of the strong hold of India, however, the edge over other space competing organizations is its enriched capability of frugal engineering in Space applications.
https://www.ambafrance-in.org/IMG/pdf/human_spaceflight_-_the_indian_way.pdf?11584/...
Dear Nageswara,
"Should this be a priority for a developing country such as India?"
Well, maybe not a priority but I think this space activity is employing many people directly and many more indirectly.
You have great great scientists in India...I'm sure this is the right way to go.
Best
I would like to tell Mr Nageshwar Rao that Space Research started in India with rockets borrowed from NASA.We developed our own rocket for ionospheric research.We .We launched geostationary satellites for application in meteorlolgy an for so many other uses .. We launched interplanetary satellites Do you know that the person who developed Defence satellites in India started his job as a rocket engineer in Thumba. Now we have developed ICBM.Who will give us these missiles if we do not develop them ourselves.Every day there is new development in technology and we have to compete with other nations.
There is no waste in spending any amount for the defence of our country
R.G.Rastogi
I am strongly against Mr Rao even thinking of any useful purpose served for our country besides the humanity.The television came to India due to pure scientific satellite research started by Dr. Sarabhai. Can we give up television now.
I agree with Dr. Mittal that development of technology have been useful for the society
I do not agree with with Dr. Callegas that there may not be PRIORITY of Space Research in India for the world but for India it is of TOP PRIORITY.
It is not the kind of research I am involved and you too. PLease do not comment on subject not of your field
R.G.Rastogi
Yes, tomorrow the 'game' will be played 'up there' and all countries will try to catch a position, so, congratulations to India!