Hi Rakesh,

I may not be able to answer all your queries. I have used Neuroscan's Synamps2 64 channel system for my PhD work at Dept of Neurophysiology, NIMHANS, Bengaluru, India. We did not have a Curry licence and used their SCAN4.5 software for aquisition and some analysis.

- It is a very robust system and has many advantages over other systems that I have used like EGI, Galileo. we have it for last 6 years. I have not used Biosemi.

- We could easily export Neuroscan to MATLAB to execute analysis. We have never tried other softwares for aquisition.

- We could easily integrate Neuroscan with E-Prime for stimulus presentation, despite having Stim2 licence and hardware. So other packages should also wok fine.

regards...

Thanks Arun for your helpful reply.

Would you please let me know whether you use any specific hardware to communicate from your stimulus presentation system to Synamps. Or we can use the computer serial/parallel port for the said purpose. For instance, to use SuperLab with Synamps the "stimTracker" hardware is required. Similarly, the Stim2 also provide hardware for better communication between the computer (used for stimulus presentation) and the amplifier.

I am asking these questions as the supplier of Synamps have said that for ERP studies Stim 2 is mandatory. Further, if I use any other stimulus presentation software then they will not provide support for any possible interface issue.

However, as far as I know if any package for stimulus presentation that presents stimulus code as TTL (transistor-transitor logic) signals can potentially be interfaced with Synamps.

I would highly appreciate your input regarding how to use Synamps with other stimulus presentation software for ERP studies. Can we send EEG triggers/response markers to SynAmps without any additional hardware/software (including Stim2).

Thanking you once again for your help and support.

Dear all,

I'm used to synamps2 either for EEG or EEG/fMRI. We also have the curry neuroimaging suite 7 for analysis.

1. Is the said EEG system better of comparable to Biosemi Active-2 system?

We have many different EEG systems here and synamps2 is still the best one.

2. If I prefer to use SynAmps (to have parity in the equipment with other collborators) then can I use some open source /free software for data acquisition and analysis or I will have to use their proposed software?

You can record the data with their software but you can then export the data to analyze wherever you want.

3. There are different licenses for Curry 7. Can  EEG and ERP studies be performed by the "acquisition and processing" license?

Yes. I think so. 

4. What are the advantages of going for the license of "Basic, Advanced source and image analysis"? 

you can also perform source analysis - curry7 can integrate all image modalities (EEG, ECOG, fMRI, MEG, structural image data...).

5.. For ERP studies they suggest Stim2 (stimulus presentation software). Can I use SuperLab or DirectRT or e-prime for the same?

I usually use psychtoolbox and presentation (neurobs) for ERPs but I already tested the e-prime and stim2 too. You can use what you want. Synamps2 just receive the triggers through the parallel port (25pin) and they will be recorded along with your data.

best

Joao

Dear Joao

Thanks for your detailed and helpful reply. Now many things are clear to me. However, I have still some doubts and hope you will be able to clear them.

Regarding use of other software for stimulus presentation for ERP study I made a query to the supplier and I am pasting below the verbatim reply.

“Any stimulus package that presents stimulus codes as TTL signals can potentially be interfaced into the Compumedics Synamp RT system. If the user chooses to use a stimulus package other than STIM2 it limits our ability to support them with any interface issues as we only provide technical support for STIM2”.

Such response creates a lot of apprehension while going for this device as it is quite likely that initially one may face interface issue. May I request you to share your views regarding the following.

1. The probable interface issues that may arise while using software other than Stim 2 with Synamps and the way to handle them (as the supplier or Compumedics deny to extend support for it).

2. Do any additional hardware (other than the cord required to connect with the 25 pin port) will be required for connecting the Synamps system with the stimulus presentation computer for sending and/or receiving trigger.

3. The SuperLab does not have facility to present stimulus codes as TTL signals. However, they supply Stimtracker for communicating with the EEG amplifier. Do you have any idea whether this will work with Synaamps?

Thanking you once again for your help and support.

Regards

Rakesh

Hello,

first I think they just said that to protect themselfs but I did not have any problem sending triggers by the paralell cable to synamps2 from any software (we have this system for 7 years now, but you should check if the new system have any particularity).

1. In fact, we have the stim2 and no one in the lab (15 people working with eeg) is using it! But I agree that it facilitates the standard ERP studies that they provide. In any case, if you want to have a flexible design for your task i'm sure you will not use stim2. 

2. We just connect e.g. the laptop with paralell port directly to synamps using a 25pin cable.

3. I dont know the stimtracker but we have here a biopac system and the triggers (sent by a serial9pin/paralell25pin) we use with biopac also work for synamps2. Note that I'm using Scan4.5 for acquisition and not the curry7. I just use the curry7 for source analysis and to coregister data of distinct modalities. 

hope it helps!

best

Thanks Joao for your prompt and helpful reply. At least I got one person who is using this system and recommends it over the others.

Rakesh,

SynAmps2 and Biosemi systems will both provide you with excellent research quality EEG/ERP data.For a stand-alone system, I prefer Biosemi.

However, for a multi-site research project, I would strongly recommend using identical recording systems at both research labs. At the every least, you will find it difficult to match basic EEG recording parameters such as sampling rates, filter setting and reference electrode locations if you have different systems. (These are all addressable issues, but require careful attention.).

The Biosemi system uses active electrodes, which significantly reduces EEG setup times. However, the electrodes tend to be a bit fragile and sets of electrodes are expensive to repair/replace. SynAmps2 does not support active electrodes. Instead, it uses the somewhat older-technology gel electrodes. Typically, Neuroscan sells quick-caps with Ag/AgCl sintered electrodes. These are more robust electrode caps, but it does take longer to setup each participant, especially for 64 channel recordings.

We have a Stim2 stimulus package, but no-one in the lab uses it. For stimulus generation we use Presentation (https://www.neurobs.com/). It is extremely flexible, but does require someone with basic computer programming skills. This runs on a Windows based PC with a Parallel Port card. To interface to SynAmps2, all that is required is the 'Stim-to-Scan' cable that Neuroscan sells, or else get someone with basic technical skills to wire one up for

Hi Rakesh, I´ve been using Neuroscan for almost 10 years, and I´ve never had any problem. Here are some answers to your questions:

1. Is the said EEG system better of comparable to Biosemi Active-2 system? Neuroscan provides a very robust system fro EEG acquistion and friendly environment for EEG/ERP analyses.

2. If I prefer to use SynAmps (to have parity in the equipment with other collborators) then can I use some open source /free software for data acquisition and analysis or I will have to use their proposed software? I would recommend in principle to use Stim2 for the stimuli delivery due to the precision it guarantees in terms of timing. For the analyses, I agree with Ross. I have the Scan Edit software (for ERP obtention) but any EEG-MATLAB toolbox (ie Fieldtrip or EEGLAB) can do the job with some basic programming skills. Personally, I prefer these options, as Scan Edit (and probably Curry) won´t let you do time-frequency analysis, for example. You must consider that these programs were especially designed for phase locked (not induced) activity. So if you´re not interested in source localisation (which by the way can be porgrammed with Fieldtrip as well) you can consider not to buy that part of the system.

3. There are different licenses for Curry 7. Can  EEG and ERP studies be performed by the "acquisition and processing" license? Yes, definitely

4. What are the advantages of going for the license of "Basic, Advanced source and image analysis"? Only if you want to do ERP source analysis (but be careful, I think you can´t do some source techiques, like beanforming)

5.. For ERP studies they suggest Stim2 (stimulus presentation software). Can I use SuperLab or DirectRT or e-prime for the same? Yes, you can.

Thanks Ross and Rodolfo for your clear and comprehensive answers to my queries and helpful suggestions. From your replies it is apparent that Synamps2 will be very useful and helpful for my studies.

Does anyone have a copy of the manual to confirm that this is indeed a parallel port connection and not serial? Anyone have luck with USB to Parallell, etc? Or is PCI best?

Found the manual and it is indeed parallel.