Could it be that there is a fifth fundamental force, a 'hypergravity' that only manifests (i.e. becomes physically significant) at a large cosmological scale ?
The gravitational field of a quark is negligible compared to their electric charge and strong charge (color). But when a sufficient amount of quarks in the form of atomic nuclei come together they produce powerful gravitational fields.
In the same way at the mass scale of planets and stars the 'hypergravitational' force
is negligible and ordinary gravity (as well as electromagnetism and other forces) plays the predominant role.
But at a cosmological scale (for mass, energy or distance, i.e. millions of solar masses) the hypergravitational force will come into the play and explain astrophysical (sp. galactic) and cosmological phenomena which seem to require 'dark matter'.
Another aproach could be through dynamical systems. The water of the ocean behaves very differently from the water in a bathtub. Ultimately this must be explained by a different scale (also different set of 'negligibles') and different values for physical and chemical parameters of the same model.
In theoretical physics, there is a general tendency to reduce the number of fundamental forces rather than increase them. We have successfully combined electric and magnetic forces to form the electromagnetic force and combined this force with the weak force to form the electroweak force. We continue to strive to combine this force with the strong force. From this point of view, it would be counterproductive to try to describe two similar gravitational effects by different forces. Our goal should be to understand the observed deviations from the predictions of Einstein's general theory of relativity before claiming new forces for them.
Consider the gravitational constant G. This tells us the force (in Newtons) exerted between two point masses of 1kg 1m apart. It is negligible for ordinary physics. If we look at Newton's law as a Laurent expansion then perhaps after the term for G (which is a quadratic term in r) there is a cubic term H m1 m2 / r^3 with H
“…Fundamental Forces and Physical Scale…Could it be that there is a fifth fundamental force, a 'hypergravity' that only manifests (i.e. becomes physically significant) at a large cosmological scale ?…’
- the space scales actions of the fundamental Nature forces are determined just by the Forces and don’t depend on some other space scales – Weak and Strong Forces act on ~ particles sizes scales, Gravity and Electric Forces act on, at least in principle, infinite scales. In physics there is no experimental data that would require to introduced/involved some additional Forces.
Though that
“…In theoretical physics, there is a general tendency to reduce the number of fundamental forces rather than increase them. We have successfully combined electric and magnetic forces to form the electromagnetic force and combined this force with the weak force to form the electroweak force. We continue to strive to combine this force with the strong force. From this point of view, it would be counterproductive to try to describe two similar gravitational effects by different forces. Our goal should be to understand the observed deviations from the predictions of Einstein's general theory of relativity before claiming new forces for them.…..”
- is with a well non-zero probability a set of incorrect claims. Really, as that is rigorously scientifically shown in the Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s 2007 initial model of Gravity and Electric Forces in
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/365437307_The_informational_model_-_Gravity_and_Electric_Forces, there is no fundamental Nature “Magnetic” force, magnetic objects/systems/events/effects are actualizations of only Electric Force, when an electric charge that radiated Electric Force mediators moves;
- besides, all real Forces are fundamentally functionally different, and so there is no sense in some “Forces unifications”. Including the “combining of electromagnetic force with the weak force to form the electroweak force” really with a well non-zero probability physically questionable theory, and some fundamental Nature “electroweak force” really doesn’t exist;
- as well as there is no real sense in forming of some “strongelectroweak” Force; and, besides,
- really there is no necessity to use the GR at elaboration of gravitational objects/systems/events/processes since it is based on fundamentally incorrect postulates, that will be possible only after really adequate to the reality Gravity theory will be developed, the development should be based on the SS&VT initial model above.
However since everything in Matter exists and happens as some specific disturbances in the Matter’s ultimate base – the[n+4+1](n+4)D dense lattice of [n+4+1](n+4)D binary reversible fundamental logical elements [FLE], which is placed in the corresponding Matter’s spacetime is the fundamentally absolute, fundamentally flat, and fundamentally “Cartesian”, [n+4+1](n+4)D spacetime with metrics (cτ,X,Y,Z, g, e, w,s, ct), where n=4 dimensions (g, e, w,s) correspond to the Forces,
- despite that all Forces act in really a bit, but fundamentally, different spaces, at high energy interactions some physical effects can be observed, which would be illusory interpreted as some “unifications of the Forces”.
Cheers
Preston Guynn I am curious if there is currently a theory of gravity that is based on special relativity but which is different from general relativity.
Agree with Walter Smilga , fewer - that is 1 force. The issue is to have 1 model to reduce to cosmology and quantum (the interference experiments). Another requirement is simpler. For over 50 years the current standard models have been becoming more complex and yet ad hoc and unexplained observations accumulate. Time for a Kuhnian type paradigm shift. I suggest
SUMMARY
Scalar Theory of Everything (STOE) unites the big, the small, and the four forces (GUT) by extending Newton's model
http://intellectualarchive.com/?link=item&id=2414
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YlJGdTvuTU
In elementary classical electromagnetism the primary bearers of charge are electrons and ions. Electromagnetic waves are produced by the acceleration or deceleration of electric charges.
Can gravitational waves be produced analogously in Newtonian mechanics ?
For instance suppose we had a body M which varied the distribution of its mass density \rho(x) in a periodic way. Then the center of mass would change periodically and thus so would the gravitational field which would exhibit periodic changes throughout space.
Are there difficulties in accounting for the properties of comets according to current physics ?
Perhaps the whole concept of 'fundamental force' is an abstraction. We should rather speak of adding parameters, state-space dimensions, and fine-tuning and improving general laws of temporal evolution for systems.
“…Perhaps the whole concept of 'fundamental force' is an abstraction.....”
- the whole concept of 'fundamental force' is, of course, an abstraction, since fundamentally exists only in humans’ theories; however the fundamental Nature forces fundamentally really exist/act in Matter, and just so Matter is as it is – and humans’ concepts in this case are fundamentally adequate to the objective reality.
That is another thing, that humans’ [mainstream physical] theories, when attempt to describe how the Forces act in Matter, are based on really fundamentally transcendent – and so really in many aspects simply fundamentally wrong – postulates, since in mainstream physics [and all other mainstream sciences, though] the fundamental phenomenon/notion “Matter” [ and all other fundamental phenomena/notions] – and so everything in Matter, including Forces, is/are fundamentally transcendent.
All really fundamental phenomena/notions can be and are, rigorously scientifically defined only in framework of the Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s really philosophical 2007 “The Information as Absolute” conception, recent version of the basic paper see
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363645560_The_Information_as_Absolute_-_2022_ed
- and more concretely relating to Matter in the SS&VT Planck scale informational physical model, two main papers are
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/354418793_The_Informational_Conception_and_the_Base_of_Physics and
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/355361749_The_informational_physical_model_and_fundamental_problems_in_physics
Correspondingly the thread question “Fundamental Forces and Physical Scale” is answered relating to Gravity and Electric Forces in the SS post on page 1, here note also that in the 2023 initial model of Nuclear Force [which essentially finalizes whole model] in
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/369357747_The_informational_model_-Nuclear_Forceit is rigorously shown that at least all these 3 Forces act in Matter by the same scheme.
Cheers
Adding forces, dimensions, matter types, energy types, etc. are done in theories to incorporate observations which should be used to reject those models. The major long term advance of human abilities comes from paradigm shifts in the light of new (troubling) observations (i.e., make theories simpler not more complex). So, the goal is one (1) forces to explain all observations.
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