Hi ...Mai,

We can study the magnetic properties of the material from electrical, optical and morphological studies. For example, MOKE (Magneto-optical Kerr effect) or SMOKE (Surface MOKE),....By using Laser light we can study the magnetic properties of the material.

I have done some work on this. Please refer my papers.

Wish you good luck.

Dear Mai,

I would add that the answer will depend on

• which magnetic properties you desire to know (I could think of many)
• what qualifies as "magnetic measurement" for you

The answers above indicate measurements that do not literally measure magnetic moment or magnetization. MOKE, for example, would still be classified as a "magnetic measurement" with me.

There was a recent, somewhat similar question here: https://www.researchgate.net/post/Can_we_make_any_basic_understanding_of_magnetic_properties_of_a_compound_based_on_its_electrical_properties

Dear Mai,

Magnetism is a good place for applying the density functional theory (DFT). You can find many papers applying these techniques to magnetic materials in my papers here in RG where sometimes new non expected magnetism has arisen. But as Kai said, it would be fundamental to know what kind of properties would you wish to predict because these techniques depends strongy of the approaches that you use in the program. For instance, it is very different if you have a basis of gaussians or plane waves for the functional space where the Kohn-Sham equations are applied.

Daniel & Gokaran,

Mai used the word "prediction", but at the same time referred to experimental methods in her question.

In my understanding, one could there rephrase the question such as to ponder whether some (non-magnetic) property is a good predictor for magnetic properties. My short answer to that is "no".

Dear Kai,

The question is:

Are there methods in which magnetic properties can be predicted without the need for direct magnetic measurements?

And the "subtitle" says:

I wonder whether it is possible to predict the magnetic properties of matter through other physical measurements such as morpholygical, electrical or optical.. etc, rather than magnetic measurement

Dear Gokaran,

DFT has a differential equation as Schrödinger's one whose states need to be defined in given functional space, for instance a Hilbert space. Thus you need to employ a certain basis ? Are you in agreement with that? What is the difficulty?

Dear Kai,

I have understood (for making compatible the question with the subtitle) that the measurements are suggested by the theoretical predictions, as always happens. Perhaps Mai can tell us what was she asking.

Dear Gokaran,

Let me to show you to cases one is a base of gaussians in a program as the deMon and other are plane waves in the Wien2k. But look at the link

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_quantum_chemistry_and_solid-state_physics_software

The use of one base or other is related with the accuracy that you want in your calculations.

@Vadim, well executed theory can provide you with insight your experiment sometimes cannot tell. It is not about making "constructs". But sometimes a clever experiment can also be very telling. I'll give an example I like in my next post. It is even related to magnetism.

Photelectron spectroscopy is an experimental technique which is ruined by magnetic fields. So one shields magnetic fields away.

In the following paper https://www.researchgate.net/publication/27684516_Local_Electronic_and_Magnetic_Structure_of_Ni_below_and_above_TC_A_Spin-Resolved_Circularly_Polarized_Resonant_Photoemission_Study , the authors claim to have demonstrated by resonance photoemission that in Nickel, local moments still exist in the paramagnetuc phase above the Curie temperature.

This is an intriguing contribution to our knowledge of magnetism, since the usual, simple picture of a Stoner metallic magnet would not predict this result.

@Mai, this of course is a pretty special experiment chosen to address a pretty special question. Not an every day thing to do. But it is nonmagnetic, since it does not require oriented moments.

Dear Gokaran,

I am not sure to speak about the same thing that you. The plane wave basis are delocalized because they are a periodic. And it is true that they can be very accurate if enough magnitude of wave vector K cut off radius has been used. Unfortunately their localization has a computational cost. A gaussian basis has not this problem because it is localized but the computational cost is much higher. The chemist that work with molecules usually use gaussian basis and Hartree Fock for a better accuracy.

Please, I have not too much time to enter in these kind of details and also it is not my interest, thus this is going to be my last answer to you in this thread about this issue. Sorry.

Hi all 🙂,

Many thanks for your answers, At first I wanted only to know if I can predict the magnetic properties from other experimentally measured properties as prof Kai Fauth Fauth understanded. Then from what Daniel Baldomir has suggested, it has come to my attention that theoretically it is possible predictable. But based on some references related to the theoretical calculations of the magnetic properties of material which I have studied, there was strongly conflict between results of experimental measurements of these properties and theoretical calculations by different software programs. Kai FauthAs for resorting to these tricks to predict the magnetic properties is that here in Egypt is difficult and may be impossible to measure the magnetic properties of thin films deposited on glass substrate accurately.

Best regards,

Mai

You are right, Mai. These experiments required synchrotron radiation as an intense source of soft x-rays with configurable photon energy, and polarization.

Generally speaking (i.e. putting aside the exceptions) you wll need some form of magnetometry to gain access to magnetic properties.

Again, we're risking the topic of the thread... but then e.g.: where would you be in your understanding of superconductivity (perfect diamagnetism), GMR, CMR, magnetocrystalline anisotropy, the sign of spin polarization at the Fermi level in magnetic metals, the suppressed spectral intensity at the Fermi level in certain correlated materials, let alone Kondo and heavy fermion behavior, were it not for some good theory? I would have been lost without their help and discussions at times.

Gorshkov and Fauth very good concluded. Very informative discussion.