Hello Miranda,

I must say it is an interesting observation. I have not actually checked my facts before adding my response, so whatever I am mentioning is based on the first reaction I had after I read your question.

Asian societies prefer their traditional alternative medications as compared to Western ones, I guess because the Asians had developed the science of alternative medicines long before the chemical components as a medicine were found for any disease and these had basis in the commonly found herbs.

Since it is so much part of the acceptance of the overall culture, they are not looked down upon as some non-sense, but rather as a science, unlike the Western World that sees these traditional medicines as based on some theories or rather beliefs of people without any scientific explanation. Although now when some active components from some of the herbs have been identified and proved to be involved in curing some of the diseases, these are becoming acceptable to them also. Like turmeric used regularly in Indian medicines have been shown to have anti-carcinogenic properties.

Another reason is the so called side-effects. Alternative medicines do not have pronounced side-effects in comparison to the chemical ones.

I have not replied to this mail in a very scientific manner, but these are my thoughts and observations and I liked the question, so wanted to make a comment.

Best Wishes,

Simran

Thanks Simran. Now we will wait for others to respond to this question.

I wonder, is it just the people of the 'East' that have such confidence in herbal medication? After all, many drugs/ medications are of plant origin. Have a great day.

I like an analogy I heard once that went like this...

The Eastern medical practices/philosophy state to hydrate, oxygenate, alkalize and used sensible nutrition. That way the body does not accumulate a 'pile of rubbish' (infections which feed bacteria, viruses and fungus). While Western medicine states don't worry about the pile of rubbish we will blame the flies and maggots and treat/suppress them.

All modern medicines are essentially toxic, that is why only doctors can administer them. Science is far to easily manipulated to find profitable practice rather than safe and effective practice. This is like spraying the fungus on a failing plant rather than moving the plant to a place in the garden where it flourishes and resists the fungus naturally. In an ideal world we use the best of both worlds and keep it as close to nature as possible while focusing on well being not a sickness industry.

Thanks Heather. My grand aunt used to tell me that western medicine is toxic.

I believed her; she's one tough individual who survived the second world war and Japanese occupation of Malaya (now Malaysia), partly by disguising as a boy.

We usually prefer herbal medication instead of chemical, as we think but whether it is proved or not we don't know that western medicine works fast but along with the good things some chemicals also go inside the body which can have a side effect, may be it can vary from person to person.

Hello again Miranda,

I was thinking about this question and I thought about African medication system. They also have a very rich traditional system of medicines. Considering the Egyptians had such tremendous knowledge that they could preserve the entire body as mummy, the same knowledge could be extended to diseases too. The holistic approach towards curing any disease was remarkable to that culture too. Since I do not know much about this aspect I cannot say what is the scenario now as in whether they like tablets or capsules or their own traditional form of medicines.

But I would really like to know what people from other parts of the world think about it. Lets hope and wait for more responses.

Regards,

Simran

Thanks, Shadma and Simran. Yes, let's wait for others to enlighten us. Each one would know their society and its practices quite well:)

I think that the point is trust and confidence. Iranian seek traditional and herbal treatments, because they think that herbal medicines are not toxic, but the chemical drugs are toxic and harmful. Many people experince side effects and complications of herbal medicines, because they do not consider the dosage of herbal drugs. ّFor instance, I saw that sombodies hospitalized because of indulgence in drinking green tea or barbery juice.

Thanks Majid. It seems to me that many different communities (although separated geographically) have great faith in their traditional, alternative medical practices. Now we wait to see what other cultures share this confidence. Thanks.

I think it depends on the disease.It is my observation that compliance to western medicine is excellent in acute disorders.But certainly when it comes to chronic and lifestyle illness patients prefer more of Traditional therapies.

The issue is mainly of tolerablity , safety and also efficacy . Evidence suggests that patients’ preferences are consistently affected by side effects.Modern medicines lacks good tolerablity in long term .Also they causes some side effects when consumed for long time.As traditional Medicines looks at the patient in totality they tends to improve Quality of life in patients ,which an most import outcome from perspective of a patient.

In certain diseases Non Compliance to Modern medications might be very Harmful,on the other hand long term compliance to toxic medications is also harmful.A good physician has to do a proper Risk Benefit analysis and educate his patient for proper compliance.

Certainly it is an good area to work on.

Thanks for your response, Avinash.

Right now I am also 'practicing' herbal medication. I suddenly developed a heat rash, so I drink lots of Chinese herb infusions, besides lots of water to remove the 'heat' and whatever 'toxins or allergy causers' that I may have accidentally consumed.

Yes, I agree that when it comes to a major disease, we should we should get medical treatment.

I do Integrative medical consultations at a large referral center. I am trained in Internal medicine but became interested in Integrative Medicine because I felt I needed more tools to help patients for whom conventional western medicine isn't helpful. I see a lot of pain and fatigue patients who have completely normal testing but I also see a lot of cancer patients who want another way. The patients most interested non-conventional medicine, in my experience, have one of three reasons.

1. They do not trust conventional medicine because they or a close friend or relative had a very bad experience in the conventional medical care system. They are turned off to the whole approach.

2. They have something conventional medicine has no treatment for such as chronic pain, fatigue, morgellons, etc. They want help but their conventional medical provider has nothing useful to offer.

3. They are very interested in promoting their own health and since conventional medicine is a disease model, they do not have a place to ask how to become healthy. Therefore, in the absence of good scientific evidence, they use whatever they read on the internet, advertising, alternative practitioners who are good salesmen, recommendations for friends, etc.

I think the willingness for people to abandon conventional medicine for alternative practices is philosophical. We live in a Post-Modernist world which means there is no absolute truth, only experience and your own belief system. Conventional medicine relys on knowledge which is what science provides. We do studies to show what works best and then recommend those treatements. A post-modernist believes thier experience and beliefs trumps knowledge so they listen to the recommendations of a conventional practitioner and they decide if the recommendation fits thier belief system. If they believe chemo is poison, they won't take it. If they believe exercise and food are healthy, they will do that. If they believe disease is caused by anerobic conditions and the root of disease is lack of oxygen they will use hydrogen peroxide IV because someone told them it breaks down into O2 and H2O providing the extra oxygen needed to treat thier condition.

It is difficult to understand from the scientifc perspective because we believe science. To them, science is just one of many choices which are all equal. They do not believe in an absolute or external standard of truth. Capitalism works to provide all the alternatives because there is money to be made selling therapies.

I spend a lot of time during my consultations to see if I can figure out their belief system and hopefully figure out a way to present a scientifically valid option of treatment that fits in that belief system so they will chose it. It takes time to do this because I have to earn thier trust before they will listen to me. That discussion is for another post.

Thanks Larry Bergstrom. Only a practitioner can provide such an answer as you have done. Thanks for adding to my knowledge!!

Dear friends, you have REVIVED my thread. I hope you will give your answers as well. I am always OPEN to learning :)

I myself don't prefer the so called western medication because of their side-effects.

Thanks Darasingh, I avoid taking Paracetamol. But then, I am quite healthy and take care to consume a lot of fruits and vegetables. When I have a cold, I double the amount of ginger and onions. When I feel 'heaty or feverish', I eat a lot of dragon fruit. Each day I drink 2 to 3 litres of water :)

Dear Miranda

I am from Tamil Nadu, South India. We have very long traditional medicinal history. We have government approved Siddha courses, which was followed by the ancestors. I used to follow Siddha. I never went to hospital for past 15 years. But the traditional medicine system should be optimized (dosage and treatment time).

Thanks Rajaram. I learned a lot from my Indian Malaysian friends about the use of saffron, star anise, cinnamon, cumin and other spices :))

Miranda! Congrats! Excellent topic! I'd encourage you to invite Dr. Max Chartrand in to the discission as well.

I have a lot of reading to do in order to be cogent. Here are some related links for all contibutors to review and share:

1.RGhttps://www.researchgate.net/post/Clarification_needed_on_Statins_and_associated_adverse_events-can_anyone_please_help

2.RGhttps://www.researchgate.net/post/What_can_you_share_with_us_about_Duchenne_muscular_dystrophy_DMD

3.LIhttp://www.linkedin.com/groupItem?view=&gid=2683600&type=member&item=5838276236538847232&commentID=5843412354049544192&goback=%2Egde_2683600_member_5843310709554835457%2Egmr_2683600&report%2Esuccess=8ULbKyXO6NDvmoK7o030UNOYGZKrvdhBhypZ_w8EpQrrQI-BBjkmxwkEOwBjLE28YyDIxcyEO7_TA_giuRN#commentID_5843412354049544192

I'm working on my last of the day,bed time, anti-snore ginger tea!

Ginger Guinea Pig!

Stats as of 23:11hrsEST 02-23-14 5 / 0 · 17 Answers · 234 Views

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85210325@N04/12673410535/

Prof Andrzej, Pardis etc, do you all have traditional food remedies or herbal remedies from your respective countries, that people seem to trust so much?

We, in the East, sometimes say that 'Food is Medicine' :))

Dear Miranda,

You may want to see the attached article on Synergy and other interactions in phytomedicines.

Thanks Md Saleem :)

So this is Phyto medicine, and this thread is about Phyto medicine as well.....

Dear Miranda

Reasons for non-adherence to prescribed medical treatment among the elderly in a family health unit in the city of Passo Fundo - Brazil -

Marques IEW, , Petuco VM and Crivellaro CGB

RBCEH, Passo Fundo, v. 7, n. 2, p. 267-279, maio/ago. 2010

Abstract :

Brazil is going through a demographic transition, and faces a new reality: the ra- pid growth of the aging population, it has to deal with chronic diseases that use health services in a large scale and leads to a high consumption of drugs. However, it is observed that the problems presented by that portion of the population resulting from drug interactions, the effects of several drugs, and the therapeutic use of complex long-term therapy associated with the mi- suse of prescribed medical treatment, are very common. The major impact of non- adherence to prescribed therapy among the elderly, both in controlling symptoms and functional capacity reduces life quality and enhances the demand of the health system. The study aims to identify the reasons for noncompliance with medical treatment prescribed for the elderly in a family health facility, in Passo Fundo – RS - Brazil, by using semi-structured interview. The obtained data were grouped into seven categories: economic factors, side effects, physical organic factor, misuse of medication, lack of family .

For the safety of herbal medicines, you may also would like to see the attached publication.

Best regards

Mohammed

Will be studying responses to this question over the next few days, Miranda, and will bring my own observations to the table. In short, getting to underlying causes beats the daylights out of succumbing to polypharmacy, and I believe most informed people surmise as much.

Yes, Max and friends, we need to take this time off to think :))

Dear friends, when you are ready, please tell us of your traditional herbal medicines, plant medicines, so that we can learn from one another. Who knows, we may preserve our health, our heart and blood vessels; we may be able to stay off statins etc; till we are near 80 years :)))

Thanks Patrick. My grand father was diabetic, he used that infusion. But my dad had a heart attack, while one of my aunts had stroke at 86. They are from a family of 13 siblings.

Probably because their traditional medicine is more effective than the western one.

When something really works you do not need to change it.

Speak the truth, give him one or two medicnes at most. Avoid poly pharmacy. Holistic approach to disease is required The problem with them or patients is they belive the modern medicine in picking the fault and belive in tradition system in fixing the fault.

As a student of modern medicine i had the oppertunity to read and understand the various traditional systems. The complexity of human mind and the body is not understood by one system alone.

Recent trends suggest that many doctors are today accepting the patients views.

Dear friends, I should say that I have nothing against western medicine, but I dislike taking all medicines. Also I have heard that pharmaceutical industries may withhold some data. Besides that, as some of you may agree, the period of testing of a drug may not be sufficient. Let's wait for more INFO to come to us from our friends in Europe, UK and US. Thanks :))

Dear All,

I was an enthusiastic partisan of herbal medicine for about 30 years. However, unfortunately, it does not work. Until somebody is healthy, herbal treatments are an excellent psychological (?) therapy. Herbal treatments cannot even help in a simple common cold. Regarding the contamination of soil and water, drogue plants may be contaminated by dangerous residues. Herbal medication is a good business opportunity for many because a lot of people believe in it.

Thanks Andras, I appreciate your view :))

András! Nothing personal! I too appreciate your views, but totally and vehemently disagree with your myopic views in this matter. This conviction is based on personal knowledge and experience over similar periods of time as you and more so in the recent 10 days of using up to 2-4grams/day of ordinary cooking ginger powder grown in the non toxic soils of rural India. Obviously, if you consume ginger grown in the radioactive soil near Kiev you may be better off on Oxycodon. It surely would be safer for any ailment compared with a Kiev grown ginger root. I hope you have some scientific evidence to prove your claim. Would you disclose to us what herbal treatments that you consumed and for what ailments over what period of time? Please make sure you educate us about the sources for your herbal concoctions. I'll look through your profile to understand your paradigm better. I write this while "religiously" drinking my 1st ginger tea of the day 0430hrs EST.

I agree with you András, regarding the need to ascertain the source of the herb or supplement. Especially the chemicals, fertilizers and pesticides used in the growth and subsequent processing. No such check is necessary for the rest of the conventional prescribed addictive medications from the "Pharmacy" with significant "side-effects" as they are all mostly synthetic anyway and highly “regulated”.

András! If this is due to the fertilizers and pesticides used in India for ginger growth, then maybe that would be better than the Oxycodon? Certainly it would be more cost-effective, wouldn't it? Lol!

Obviously, there is a lot more to this subject. I intend to read, listen & learn from this erudite company. Relying entirely on herbal medicine with no checks & balances without employing modern tools and techniques would also be foolhardy! [email protected]

President, Ginger Guinea Pig Association of the World! LOL!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85210325@N04/12673410535/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85210325@N04/12673410535/

Let me confess to all of you my failure in recruiting my mom and my wife in this ginger fantasy of mine yet. My Dad & Son are both convinced by my example of results. Therefore, I do understand the skepticism! You really think I’d stop my ginger love on account of a few skeptics that don’t like the taste of ginger. My resolve has gotten even firmer after reading the copious literature about ginger on the internet compared with the warnings of blindness, impotency and stupidity in the use of just the statins for cholesterol or Actos for blood sugar. Just examine the lawsuits concerning only Actos. Causes bladder cancer?

Even my office mate doesn't believe my results. It is hard to prove to others that my pains from decades have slowly but surely just vanished in 10 days. Placebos don't work gradually, do they? She says that all the positive impact (past 2 weeks) to my body from 1 to 4 grams of ordinary cooking ginger powder a day is the good old "placebo effect". That sounds really scientific doesn't it? Just guessing without even trying? She dislikes the taste so it must be a placebo! It is amazing how we humans can rationalize even the most obvious fallacies! LOL!

In April when I check my blood after 6 weeks of consistent use, I'll know for sure if my blood sugar, blood pressure & cholesterol can be controlled with 1-4 grams of ginger powder per day? I promise to be honest. The key is 1-4 grams of powder a day per adult. Not just some dilute tea or cooked to destroy the effective enzymes. Go ahead prove me wrong. Try for 10 days. That's all! Guaranteed, you'll turn into an addict of the resulting general good health toe to teeth! Amazing!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85210325@N04/10659886546/

I think that it should not be the case .The patient should take the medicine whenever it exists

Hatem! Should these medicines be taken despite their debilitating side effects? The point is that there are age old safe remedies that have been forgotten and overlooked for the more advertised modern Pharma Brands. Ginger is not a secret and neither is garlic in terms of their healing power. Obviously, one must use modern techniques and medicine as well but not necessarily exclusively. That is my point. A judicious and informed use!

For example, I notice among my Arab friends and relatives the extensive use of antibiotics for almost any illness including the common cold. This is a dangerous practice because the body and bugs develop tolerance and make antibiotics less effective when really needed.

i think when herbal treatment do not works we must take drugs prescribed by medical consult. Modern medical treatments are saving lives, so people who prefer traditional medicine must be aware of the dosage too; However herbal medicine could be used as prevention from any disorder illness or as body cleaner from pollution or food excess.

Dear friends, I think that for those who are comfortable with antibiotics, statins that doctors recommended could just get on. But if our health is reasonably good, we may have an option. Thanks for your views. We wait for other friends to join us and share their knowledge :)

Sent from mobile.

Just to stimulate discussion: What is ‘Phytotherapy’? Why do those that apply phytotherapy make a human-invented distinction between plants consumed or digested versus plants observed or perceived? Plants digested and plants perceived are just acting on different parts of the human body, either via physiology (energy, metabolism) or neuron system receptors. Any plant component that improves health status could thus by definition be placed under the heading ‘Phytotherapy’. Thus, phytotherapy would involve all visual vegetation stimuli or components that lower stress and consequences of stress (e.g. depression), all vegetation stimuli or components that act directly on physiology, neurology or immunology, or all plants or plant substances that change external appearance to improve social interaction and integration.

In all ethnobotanical studies we carried out in Palestine, we found that the majority of CAM users lacked an appropriate awareness of potential risks of pharmaceutical interactions between herbs and prescribed medicines. Therefore, CAM integration within conventional care can work far better if greater information about possible adverse effects is made available to both patients and physicians alike.

Dear Ravi,

I have no idea and experience with Indian herbal products. I have described my own experiences during more then 30 years with European medicinal plants. Certainly, I know almost all the Hungarian and some of the German literatures of this subject.

I am sorry I have not known your activity with ginger products and I am not a chemical medicament agent but a simple man who has some personnel history. I hope I will have still 30 years of collecting some more experiences on this subject.

Please, listen to this song, it has some beneficial impact on health http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8cCDIlx2Uk&feature=kp

Dear friends, thanks for your great contributions. I will be back as soon as I can :)

The reason could be not-so-good experience. Many of my friends and relatives resort to herbs and "shaman's" recommendations only when "Western"- prescribed medicines failed after a significant number of intakes. It actually happened to a number of family members. What is surprising is that professional doctors do not discourage us from doing so. There are really a lot of alternative medicines that are better.

Greetings! I have some simple questions for you folks.

1. Have any of you before this day heard of ordinary cooking ginger powder (1-4 grams per adult per day, $5 per 300+grams) as a direct therapy for the following ailments?

Including but not limited to RA Pain, sinusitis, common cold/cough, elevated blood pressure, elevated blood sugar, elevated cholesterol, hemorrhoids, digestive health, colon cancer prevention, body odor, bad breath, Alzheimer’s, Dementia, viral infections, bacterial infections, diminished immune response, some cancers, INFLAMATION etc, etc. I hadn't heard of this till I started researching on Google about 2 weeks ago. I've documented some of my findings in the discussion links I posted earlier.

2. How many of you know that ordinary cooking ginger powder is as ubiquitous in India as butter or milk (or salt & pepper) are in the rest of the world? I've heard of more milk allergies than ginger!

Over 1 Billion people use it in daily cooking with little or no adverse reactions. My wife is psychologically allergic to it. I know this because she has eaten stuff without knowing ginger presence having no challenges. In my opinion, ginger allergy is poppycock. However, I do concede such allergies to plant matter may exist but rarely in the case of ginger. Ginger is a fantastic therapy for allergies too.

3. How many of you are aware of anyone with allergy to ginger?

I haven't yet come across anyone in my 5.5 decades of experience in India and the US. Surprise me! OK! So feed ginger tablets to your pets and animals (cf. Chimps). I bet they will become healthier. Try it cost effectively on a pet dog with severe Arthritis. No fear of the "placebo" effect there I suppose. LOL! :-)

4. How many of you knew that ginger powder is a highly effective and safe way to disinfect potable drinking water by adding small amounts?

My father tells me that it was common practice in his and other household during his childhood. Wonder why not now. People have lost the knowledge over time and modernization.

András! The Europeans have integrated the herbal treatments in their medicine better than most in the world. It is not a question of Indian or European herbs. It is a matter of proper and safe sourcing for the herbs devoid of radiation, chemical fertilizers and pesticides. I will certainly not argue the positive effects of music to human health and well being. Try this!:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njYdQGh7QBo

KC! "Perhaps they do not have sufficient information". Perhaps they know better. Have you studied the warnings of adverse reactions to some of these conventional medications? The litany of side-effects is petrifying even to us, the erudite. If their doctors explained better, these folks would be driven further away, in my humble opinion. That said, I do understand that some of us "old fogies" are a bit stubborn and must be open minded to modern targeted treatments of specific ailments. Or, you'd end up hurting yourselves. Talk to your doctors please. Make an informed choice.

Marcel! "some people might be more or less allergic to one plant component". Absolutely! This must be vetted out. The list of allergies and adverse reactions to conventional medications is fairly well documented. Ginger on the other hand has been tried and tested for this aspect for millennia and presently by more than a Billion individuals in India. We have a veritable Ginger Guinea Pig farm there.

Eddie! I agree!

I'm no expert! I'm just sharing my personal experience and Google data with you folks. Quack! :-)

@Ravi, I like fresh ginger, onions and garlic besides saffron, cloves, anise and cinnamon. The fragrances are fantastic. Please tell me their medical benefits.

When my ancestors came to Malacca and then moved to Penang in the 1700s, they were employed as builders. When exhausted in the heat, they chewed on garlic and onions, and drank water :)

From reading about garlic (and onion) a while back (a decade), I understand it has similar properties as ginger. However, garlic must be taken with enteric coating to survive the stomach acids. Otherwise the beneficial properties are lost. Garlic must either be infused through the salivary glands by chewing raw or must be enteric coated. Chewing is tough for most of us. I enjoy it raw! But the halitosis and BO are not pleasant for others around you. It doesn't work in business environments. I've used enteric coated garlic/mint combination for a while. It did help. Somehow didn't follow through as my health need was not as acute then. No RA pains a decade ago!

"saffron, cloves, anise and cinnamon", I'm sure have many benefits I haven't read yet. However cooking with them is not necessarily the best way to extract the maximum benefit. Not only that, the amounts needed are orders of magnitude greater than one can assimilate through cooked foods.

Miranda! "When exhausted in the heat, they chewed on garlic and onions, and drank water", obviously a cost effective way to stay healthy. In the "old days", salt, the etymological root of the word salary, was used as compensation for work. Salt was money! Garlic grew wild and anyone could harvest it without fear of persecution. Do keep in mind that garlic is sort of like an apple with a "twist". Just as "an apple a day will keep the doctor away", "some garlic a day will keep everyone else away". Even Dracula! Can't catch a cold with no one near you, can you? Garlic is also the "fidelity" herb. Wives feed their hubbies garlic to keep all the "evil eyes" away (Egypt). Extremely versatile herb, garlic :-)

My ancestors never moved from Kerala, India since memory until my dad who served in the Military as a career. They were scholars and priests, Brahmins! Many south Indian Brahmins do not eat garlic at all. I’m the wayward McDonald Brahmin vanquishing cholesterol with ginger! LOL! :-)

Thanks for many interesting points about garlic :))

Yes, I learnt from my aged relatives all about how my ancestors sailed to Malaysia. When Penang was founded they moved there, and were active in construction of houses and govt buildings. The skills were handed down from generation to generation.

Sometimes, I wonder what would have been our future, if they had sailed to US, land of the brave and the free.

Please carry on with your push ups, sit ups and ginger consumption :))

Long term use of most prescription drugs bring new health problems from at least two vantage points: 1) it delays the urgency and therefore the determination to find and address underlying causes of one's disease (most of the time as a result of nutritional deficiencies, food additive sensitivities, chronic dehydration, harmful lifestyle substances, heavy metal accumulations, environmental exposure, sedentary lifestyle, lack of restful sleep, mental health issues, and overprocessed foods), and 2) most of these medications are toxic to the body in the long-term and bring entirely new health challenges from side/interaction/withdrawal effects.

Addictions due to pain and nerve block medication is rampant in our nation today and getting worse as physicians continue to dole out opioid meds, including morphone, like candy for chronic pain. America consumes 82-84% of the worlds opioids with only 4% of the world's population. This has set millions of Americans on a totally wrong course and is taking a huge amount of manpower from agencies like the FBI, overloading our disability rolls with no end in sight, and welfare rolls, which are growing at unprecedented levels. I am embarrassed to bring out such a saliant point, but even more embarrassed if I do not. I am in hopes that we will reverse course soon if we want to remain a free and prosperous and healthy nation.

Dr Max, sir you have definetly raised a good point.

If medicine is so simple as it has to be believed that disese starts from a simple vitamin deficiency, or an over processed food, or wrong food consumptions, then a good education will eliminate the use of these harmfull drugs. Can someone suggest the cause of psoriasis, and can any one prdict the course of the same.

How many can predict the occurence of a heart attack by estimation of vitamins in your body. If the argument that you have raised is accepatable then there must also be a case study to demanstrate the occurence of higher incedence of disease in vitamin deficient persons. Lets this begin as an exercise. Im willng to go any far if arguments regarding heath and vitamins are substanciated.

Dear friends, thanks for your contributions. I have been away from the college, since Wednesday, and I just got back :)

"If the argument that you have raised is accepatable then there must also be a case study to demonstrate the occurence of higher incedence of disease in vitamin deficient persons". This should be a "no brainer". If such a study has not yet been conducted then the motivations of the medical profession is quite clear. They don't intend to find out. Opiates work better in keeping them (patients) quite!

I have a simple question for all you "doctor types", when you cut open a patient is there a marked difference on the insides of patients that have proper nutitional balance (vitamins) versus those patients not paying heed to such trivialities?

Max, Ravi, Satyaprasad and friends: so it would seem that western medicine is treating the symptoms, right? And the medical problem is not cured?

Judicious use of such medication is key! Many in the west & east are allive because of advanced western medicine. My parents are on many after a triple by-pass and colon cancer. However, the philosophy of treating ailments needs to be reconsidered and natural remedies with much lower risk factors must be studied, evaluated for efficacy and promoted.

I'll share with you the battle that my wife and I had for the past 4 days with virulant chest cold and cough. The difference between us was that I was on 4 grams of ginger for the past 3 weeks while she was not. She was ill from Monday and is just getting over it after 4 days. I helped her with the chores a bit while nursing her. I felt a little affected last night. I doubled up on ginger with capsules as well. I coughed a bit at night and now am fine. I'm drinking my first ginger tea with powder. I always swallow the ginger residue at the bottom of my cup. One day with ginger while 4 days without the aid of ginger. You pick!

Satyaprasad, thank you for the question. There is sufficient evidence of nutrient deficiency, heavy metal toxicity, polypharmacy spawned conditions, chronic dehydration, toxic food additives (otherwise declared "safe" whatever that means-short term or over a lifespan?), unhealed injuries of a lifetime, continuous subclinical infections. These, in combination, of course, are not so simple nor do they jump off the page to casual observers. The relationship between lack of second stage B12 and loss or gain of myelin of nerves is totally disregarded as a causal or ameleorative influence on neuropathies of all kinds in Western Medicine. Are we to believe that neuropathies are a lack of nerve block medication? Diabetes type two, grown 13 times per capita in our country over the past 40 years--and exponentially growing at breakneck speed upward--and instead of asking ourselves if it could be a probem of a sterile, microwaved, degeminated, high fructose laden, genetically modified, over processed diet. Western Medicine responds with...what...vague, limp-wristed advice about diet and exercise with a hardy course of insulin-inspiring medicines and wonder why they get sicker instead of more healthy.

Instead of getting to the underlying causes of hypertension--those listed above including long term acidosis--patients are given, not one, but two, maybe three, four, five or more diabetes-inspiring blood pressure and edema medications. And we wonder why their disease is so deeply entrenched and ever worsening. Only the densest and most trusting patient would comply for long with such a dismal prognosis. The body is built of nutrients, water, oxygen, negative ions (anions), restoriative sleep, exercise, a positive mental attitude; it operates on a Kreb's Cycle and must be more alkaline than acid, it can only handle so many toxins, prescribed or environment, before it responds with disease.

You mentoned psoriasis, which does not happen in a vacuum, but occurs in the same way other chronic conditions happen,,,not one nutrient (although that would be simple, as in the case of scurvy, to correct) but manifold nutrients and toxic exposures, the whole package of modern life--we have starved our bodies of that which nature has designed to provide. But watch those same conditions resolve once ALL of the factors--not just one or two in isloation in a controlled study--are addressed en masse and simultaneously. The empirical evidence is everywhere and all around us, and we are still waiting for the one nutrient to demonstrate its efficacy. Meanwhile, many are walking away from the failed, wrong-headed system of Big Pharma and endless testing and unneeded surgeries and big dollars it all entails, and finding that going back to basics is where they get well, the closer to organic, to a peaceful life, the fewer environmental toxins, and disease in all its forms become moot topics of concern. The father of Western Medicine spent 20 years of his life in prison for stating the obvious, "Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food" among other things. Would he fare any better today with advice? Perhaps not, because there is no money in being healthy and staying that way.

Miranda--yes, symptoms only while totally and utterly ignoring underlying causes. Big money in the former and a humble mission of mercy and willingness to serve our fellow man in the latter.

@Ravi, Max et al: thanks. Big, big thanks for all this knowledge you are giving us!

I just need to ask, can people turn around and say that herbal medicines (like ginger :))) also cure the symptoms only?

Brilliantly said Max!

We have to remember, Miranda, that most modern medicines are synthetic copies of a gentler natural remedy. The former is patentable and can create a monopoly of sorts while the latter is in the public domain and not of any individual's ownership. But, yes, herbal can be used to treat symptoms (and often is--and generally much safer than its synthetic counterpart). Using medicines for symptoms is not inherently bad, especially in acute disease. But in chronic disease, why would one want to take Cat's Claw, Ginger, or any other herbal diuretic for years at a time for, say, hypertension, when they could get to the underlying causes, such as chronic semi-dehyrdation, emotional stress, inflammation, untreated infection, heavy metals, nutrient deficiency, caffeine intake, food sensitivity, or whatever is causing the problem? Hence, treating symptoms in the short term is not really a problem--its the squandering of the opportunity to dig deeper and actually get the patient well in the long run that matters. Healing, not managing, is the watchword of true medicine.

Thank you Dr Max for the exiting debate. Your view that the body is dependent on Vitmains, Krebs cylce, mitochondria, acidosis, is quite correct.

Today food or medicine is packed stored and sold. Nutrients are added and advertised.

Kentucky, Mcdonalds, Nestle, Cadbury, you name it they are making their presence in the market.

How much have these companies contributed towards disease production is a million dollar question.

Yes, indeed. Satyaprasad, If we are truly what we eat (which we are to a great extent) many of us have left it up to the fast food marketers and agribusiness conglomerates, in collusion with politicians and regulators who often have their own agendas, to decide who we are, our level of health and longevity, and that of future generations. We know, for instance, that with the depletion of soils and genetic modification and degermination that we must supplement our nutrition. The problem then rests in the question of which nutrients and how delivered. In our work, we have determined that most commercially available nutrition, while having some value where the need is great, is generally lacking in bioavailability.

Organic is the keyword here, the closer to organic, whole foods, and yet efficient in terms of food to nutrition synthesis, the closer one is to filling some of the gaps. We generally subscribe to a diet where at least 50% of it is fresh fruits and vegetables, and whole grains is the most ideal for most people in avoiding and overcoming many chronic conditions. Hydration and moderation with caffeine etc. is also important. Being selective of which items are purchased from the current food offerings is of utmost importance (enough consumers following the above regimen and we will see a sea change in what the merchants have to offer!).

I know it is tough to reduce the wide array that nature both offers and requires for optimal health into neat, elegant studies--for instance, we need (naturally) acidic foods to yield a mildly alkaline (7.45) cellular pH or our Kreb's Cycle will provide us with less than an optimal metabolism. The list goes on, but in every case, it is immensely more complex and multifaceted than we would like to admit, variety being a key factor, and not given to simple double blind and controlled studies--how do we control for the endless varieties of organic substances, each one representing a virtual universe of complexity?

Yes, we can research it , even run scientific studies on most of it without too much difficulty, but first we have to throw out the theoretical frameworks that espouse mechinistic, closed systems and go for the open systems of what I call "wholism" (the modern and more accurate view of "holism"). Thank you again for the discussion on a most vital topic.

Max! "The father of Western Medicine spent 20 years of his life in prison for stating the obvious, "Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food" among other things." Who was that?

Miranda! It is not the treating of the symptom that is a challenge with ginger but the opportunity in the myriad of its positive side-effects. Alopathic medicine may cure a symptom but has the risk of the myriad of adverse side-effects. To claim ginger "cures only the symptom" or that it is a placebo one must have tried it for at least 10 days (4 grams/day/adult in powder form). Try it in that dosage and you'll see. Even if it were a placebo, I'm a loyal convert now. The mind is a powerful healer. So any patient that thought any medicine did not work in his mind may possibly find conventional medicine to be a placebo too. Same with ginger. If one truly believes that it does not work, then it is likely that it may not work for them. This is true with conventional alopathic medicines too. Patient's positive mental attitude is critical for modern doctors to heal their patients.

BTW my cough and cold lasted only one day with 4 grams of ginger per day. I slept from 12 noon to 1AM. My wife is still suffering despite cough syrup and antibiotics. I wonder why a doctor would prescribe antibiotics for a viral infection? 5th day now! I'll get her on the ginger program once she is ready.

Satyaprasad! The last time I visited Mysuru, India in January 2013, I ate only in US frachise restaurants like Dominos, "Kentucky, Mcdonalds, Nestle, Cadbury" etc. The couple of times I ate at a regular place my stomach became really ill. It must be the ingedients or the water they use at the US franchise restaurants that kept me from stomach illness. It is not the presence of such franchises that is the challenge but the uninformed use of their products by us consumers. General nutritional education would certainly help those of us that have lost touch with the natural ways of our ancestors in the modern era.

Placebo? BTW I believe ginger works directly on "acidosis". Try it! Unless you are willing to try ginger on yourself first, please do not recommend for use to others!

Ravi, it was Hippocrates--when you study the historical account of this great man you find he was quite a down to earth sort who saw nature as the arbiter of health. He shied away from the bullying and dangerous medicine of his day--wow, history repeating itself! He would be as unwelcome today as he was in former times of profound ignorance.

BTW, I don't think MIranda was challenging the notion of treating symptoms so much as defining when such needs treated. When treating viral infections with antibiotics--something that often has to be done to control for secondary bacterial infections one they set in--one loses a degree of immunological control in exchange for the surer antibacterial action. But when bolstering the body's immunity with substances like ginger, garlic, curcumin, and a host of natural antibacterial agents, immunology is left in tact and recovery more complete. But, lest we get carried away, we need to remember that without the lifesaving antibiotics we have today, many illnesses would indeed be more commonly fatal.

The key is using the natural agents in the early and milder stages of disease, or else one will have no choice but to using the much more powerful drugs of allopathy. Hence: natural remedies for prevention and early disease, the powerful antibiotics for acute infections. The best of both worlds creates a better fit for today's health challenges, I believe.

Heather! Are you aware of ginger being "super brain food" in your many years of involvement in holistic mental health? Claims include retardation of Alzheimer's and Dementia You could make a killing on EBay or Amazon retailing good quality ginger powder. I was amazed at the size of the ginger market on these two media.

I believe my thinking has gotten sharper as well after 3 weeks on the ginger program (4 grams/day/adult of dry powder). I just don't have a way to demonstrate it you yet. Perhaps my blogging from the past in comparison with the present may have a clue to my improved mental state? :-)

Max! Thanks a million for taking your time to educate us laymen. Thankfully I'm confident you will not "hear the knock on your door" in the US for being truthful.

I do realize Miranda's hypothetical query about ginger. At least she didn't ask if folks thought ginger's benefits and effects on symptoms are a placebo paradigm :-)

I love the new trivia I just learnt about Hippocrates! "Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food". Thanks again Max!

"we need to remember that without the lifesaving antibiotics we have today, many illnesses would indeed be more commonly fatal". This I'm in complete agreement with. My parents are a perfect example. However, the point was that if antibiotics are prescribed as a knee jerk reaction for a cold or flue often (once or twice a year) then they may be rendered useless when needed for a "lifesaving" situation later in life like SARS or H1N1 or Anthrax. I'm unaware of microbes developing immunity to ginger or other natural medicine yet. I do clearly see your point in, "The best of both worlds creates a better fit for today's health challenges". Thanx Max!

bugs do become resitant to antibiotics after some time. Well coming to the answer of the original question, leaving a deed half done is common for some. There is a story that gos like this. A man had gone to the doctor he paid his fees since the doctorr has to live he purchased the medicine since the pharmacist has to live, he did not use medicines since he has to live. Now here is the actual dilema, the faith. Side effects of medicines, oveerdosing, clearing of symptoms after the second or third dose.

Againthe diseases are characterisd by heir recurrence, severity and life threatening.

A doctor should be certian and sure abou what he is treating, and the dose required rather than following a blind yard stick.

Following the yard stick is done to save the doctor from the legal angles.

Who has to decide how much medicine is required for whom and when.

The doctor. now the grading, and severity and complications of an incomplete treatment will attract punismient to the doctor, hence he is supposed to follow the rules.

Unless the agency which governs the doctors is more flexible only the you would see a much transparent prescriptions.

Dear Ravi, Dr Max et al., I am all for herbal medicine. Generally I am quite healthy. For me, an apple a day, or a dragon fruit a day keeps the doctor away. When I had dengue fever, I was still able to work although not as efficiently as normal. I drank lots of coconut juice. Once, I had chicken pox. I drank a lot of winter melon soup.

But there may be some people who are used to their western medicine. I'm not an authority on it like Max is. @Ravi, it's true that you are a greater blogger since ginger came into your life :)

Sent from mobile.

Coconut juice for Dengu fever & water melon soup for Chicken Pox, my belief in herbal medicine isn't that strong yet, Miranda! But it sure indicates to me that you would have no trouble with 4 grams of ginger powder per day. Have you tried it yet, while healthy? I urge anyone clicking the "Green" approval arrow below to try ginger powder or capsules as well and help with the statistics of the ginger test. I promise that it won't hurt you if you are healthy. But would transform you if you are ailing.

Dear friends, coconut and winter melon are cooling, or the better word may be hydrating. While ginger is considered heaty.

@Ravi, I will get the ginger, because the Chinese community are concerned about YinYang balance

Sent from mobile.

Now that you brought up the subject of ginger's "heaty" to the body issue as pointed out by my parents as well, I'll dig it a little deeper. Other than the induced "good fever" by ginger, do you mean anything else? In India "heaty" means pimples and apses on the skin and body. Is this similar to the conception for "heaty" of the Chinese as well? If that is so then the cause could be the detoxification process induced by ginger. In my case existing pimples and apses disappeared miraculously after 10 days of 4 gms/day ginger use. Could it be that the rejected toxins from the body manifest themselves that way? Dr. Max or anyone else qualified in these matters to the rescue please! We don't want Miranda to get too "hot" with the threat that she "will get the ginger". Let's see how accessible good ginger powder or capsules are in her neck of the woods. :-)

BTW both "coconut and winter melon" have high sugar content, don't they?

Miranda! I'd love to learn a bit more about the Chinese community's concerns about YinYang. I plead ignorance about YinYang. I thought I was "Yin" and my wife "Yang". We've been working on the "balance" thing for over two and a half decades now :-)

Unlike Dr. Max here I've just read some of your awesome contributions of knowledge and will take the opportunity to dredge this subject further as I see this as potentially life saving but definitely life altering paradigm. I promise to read every detail of your posts and comment again. I'm confident of the tremendous learning experience ahead for me. Exciting!

Heather! "In an ideal world we use the best of both worlds and keep it as close to nature as possible while focusing on well being not a sickness industry" That was only a small excerpt of your text but it befuddles me that anyone erudite or ignorant about life or medicine could find that disagreeable or fallacious. You hit the nail on the head! Must have hurt :-).

Simran! Anyone born in India has some grand parent that would advise the use of ordinary cooking turmeric (demonstrated time and again safe by eating it) for skin apses, and other stomach disorders. I now know of its anticancer property as well. But the profuse use of turmeric in south Indian cooking hasn't impeded the growth of the epidemic in India. my mother a teetotaler, non-smoker, vegetarian, eating generally health food suffered and successfully recovered from stage 3 colon cancer through modern chemotherapy. A life saver for her! Just as ginger it may have to do with the daily dosage required and the best way to assimilate.

Miranda! Someone must have challenged your brave grandma to "Man-up Girl!". Thankfully she took the challenge successfully. Look at the results in you Miranda, the Fearless Blogger! Love you Grandma!

Sadma! If you eat it and it don't hurt, then it ought to be safe at the least. I say, that is a good test to start. However, a scientific analysis would create more confidence wouldn't it? I just want to know what's the hold up? Turmeric and ginger lobby don't have the clout, I suppose. It's got to be a huge industry for food why aren't they aggressively investing in such research for medicinal use? That Industry is too fragmented and doesn't have the savvy of the "Pharma" Lobby. Sadly, it must be done the more inefficient way, Government sponsored for the public good! That sounds like a guised liberal rant don't it?

This whole subject surely deserves more research and attention than given it thus far. It is silly to intentionally wear a blind-fold in this matter. Let's open our minds folks! Despite, the "Big Pharma's" investments in keeping it shut! Maybe we could find the veritable "ginger" for Obamacare while saving our lives!

MR Ginger Ravi i think you will soon be patenting Ginger. Try your luck with garlic too. Nature has definitely produced herbs to heal your body. Toxins which get accumulated has to be detoxified through a process called pancha karma as it is called in Ayurveda. The role of Vitamins is the same as is herbs and ginger. Food is divided into three types based on its quality. Vata Pitta or Kapha or satva , Tamo or Rajo gunas. A unique combination works in the human body by dominating a particular quality. these qualities are again subjected to scrutiny by your thoughts, actions envy greed, etc. So it means that your behaviour and attitude towards others and to life determines what you eat, how you eat. Ginger is just on of them.

I think many of you don't sleep enough. With more sleep (adding dreams please) you don't have to take all these stuff.

Cheers

Interesting explanation!

Dear friends, thanks for your posts. Many interesting things have said :)

@Marcel, I think you are right. Our fellow bloggers should be resting in sweet dreamland but they prefer to be BLOGGING :)

@Ravi: Do You know something Ravi? I have my fears like all of us. So I'm not really: 'the Fearless Blogger'. I just am honest, it's the result of being caned for every time I prevaricated, in my young days. Perhaps some people don't like the truth, so some of my posts were down voted on some threads. See my thread concerning blood groups, ok? From my question, it is obvious that I accept contradictory ideas, but it still got down voted.

https://www.researchgate.net/post/What_is_your_view_that_blood_groups_have_a_relationship_to_personality_Do_you_agree_a_little_moderately_or_disagree

@Ravi et al., this is so true: 'This whole subject surely deserves more research and attention than given it thus far.' Unfortunately, I am at a college where all my research must be on learning, and nothing else :(

Just see my recent publications, you will know it's the truth.

@Ravi, coconut juice isn't coconut milk. I trust you know the difference. The juice has some sugar content, but all natural sugars.

Winter melon is BLAND, not sweet at all. It needs to be boiled with water. It's a large gourd. It's not water melon. (Partly because of my herbal medicines, I'm spending much time in the kitchen. It's great to watch Sunsets from the kitchen window :))

Marcel! "Sleep" is one of the best vitamins, detoxant and rejuvenator. I never compromise. I need no less than 7 hours now. I could manage with 6 but 9 hours or more makes my back ache. But as you rightly point out, unless I get my minimum beauty rest, I'm a cranky dinosaur. I just notices Dr. Max mention the acute need for sleep (herbal induced or natural, without the aid of Big Pharma products, I think) as an essential element for the treatment of DMD. I know this as well from over five and a half decades of expertise in sleeping. BTW the individual sleep quota maybe different. e.g., my wife needs at least 2 hours more than I. It is the wondrous activities of the sub-conscious during the "sleep" period that I believe is responsible for the re-construction within the body & mind.

Satya! No patents on ginger or garlic concoctions yet. But worth working on it. Once I see more data from volunteers for either self-therapy. However, do you have any ideas about what the seasoned Indians mean when they state that ginger is "heaty" for the body besides the temporary seeming elevation of body temperature? I'll have use a thermometer to measure my body temperature after consumption of ginger and observe the "fade away" as well.

Miranda! I love coconut water and am very familiar with coconut milk, being from southern India. In fact, the profuse use of coconut milk in south Indian cooking, I believe, to be a culprit for the alarmingly high rates of heart challenges among southern Indians. Coconut milk has some natural sugars but I drink it sparingly to reduce the sugars overall, natural or otherwise. Winter melon, I have no clue but would like to try for sure! "Caning" I'll skip. Never experienced it! That practice ended when my parents were little when one of the students sharpened a pencil and stabbed the "caning" teacher in the back of his hand. The caner's hand was paralyzed from it. "Caning" and "flogging" are still practiced in some modern yet archaic cultures with a false sense of propriety. They ought to try Dale Carnegie of Maxwell Maltz instead. These are tantamount to virtual lobotomy in many cases and create no ill feelings towards the proponent.

Ginger Alert! Just as it took nearly 10 days for some of my RA symptoms to be relieved, the reverse is true as well. Meaning, just because I didn't have my 4 grams yesterday the RA pains did not come back. I barely consumed 0.5 grams. Just wasn't in the mood or forgot or whatever. The point is that the beneficial effects are sort of "residual" with herbal medicine as they attack the cause rather than just the symptoms. This would be true for ginger or garlic or other. This is unlike OTC pain killers. The more you have the more you need. Even the "pain" gets tolerant to the "pain killer"? While they fix the "pain" they mess with the rest of the body! FYI!

Ginger powder is fantastic with bad old ugly American Pizza! Be generous! Almost as generous as the garlic powder, or hot peppers or cheese powder you'd use. It eliminated the "lactose intolerance" generally associated with delicious Pizza for me! Nothing will get between me and my Pizza! I was weaned on Pizza, Coke & Beer (no wonder I have diabetic precursors) for the 1st 6 months at Rutgers in the US (1979) when I put on nearly a third of my body weight from an emaciated (not really, just skinny:-) 111 lbs at the age of 22. I'm now still about 155 lbs.

If someone tracks back in recent Indian history, you'd see a direct correlation to disease with the unrestricted availability of processed sugar, rice, oil and flour in the open market once India became "self sufficient" somewhere in the early 1960's. Until then there was Government sponsored "rationing" in effect for these household commodities due to limited availability. No such rationing for ginger or other good herbs then. Once such restrictions were gone, I bet the general health of the society has gone down the tube on account of nutrition. Of course, Big Pharm came to the rescue of those afflicted with obesity, diabetes, hypertension, high cholesterol, etc. etc.

And what about the interaction between herb treatments and sleeping patterns? Herbs or other treatments have more beneficial effects when people express 'optimal' sleep patterns. I doubt, herbs truly work when people are over-stressed because of lack of sleep.

Sleep is like breathing. Poor sleep will mess it all up. Herbal or allopathic medicine is no substitute for pure and simple unaided sleep. There is a whole industry focused on capitalizing on just sleep today. But many have survived sleep depravation for years successfully. The Nazis were specialist in this branch of study as were many other human torturers in history including Tippu Sultan of India who experimented with the British prisoners in submerged dungeons in Srirangapatna, Mysuru. The Britts had to hold Tippu's kids as hostages for him to surrender eventually. I'm not sure if it was "valor" or "inhumanity" on both sides that is highlighted by this monument to Colonel Bailey. Neither Tippu nor the Britts had any business being there subjugating & torturing the people of Mysuru, India with their violent outlandish foreign concepts.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/201497/dark-dingy-dungeons-srirangapatna.html

Hi Ravi,

I do not want to stress the biological significance of imposed extreme sleep patterns that are often short-term. Just within the 4-10 hours range of sleep there might be an interaction with medical treatments. Why people sleep more or less is obviously individual-biology driven (some people require less sleep than other), but also environment-driven (e.g. imposed non-sleep because of community or other social reasons not taking individual biology into account)

Marcel! I agree, as long as "imposed extreme sleep" doesn't mess with the body! During "Spring Fest" at under-graduate school dorm (IIT Kharagpur), I remember staying up as much as nearly a whole week with less than 2 hours of cat naps per day practicing Rock & Roll, Drama, etc. without alcohol, "speed", "meth" or "cocaine". Just high on the adrenaline of the festival. Survived it unscathed. That is my personal experience with sleep depravation. Never during "exam time" though. Youth & exuberance substituted for sleep then. I don't have the advantage of youth now. I've increase exuberance, which is the only parameter in my control.

Dear friends, I have shared this question with 10 persons that may benefit from our discussion. I could be one of the first to ask questions on exercise, and herbal cures on RG. Whoever is more than 30 years old, is 'quite old', but still not old yet. Because age has to do with health, rather than plain chronological age.

Sent from mobile.

Marcel! Unfortunately many allopathic sleep inducers (narcotics & opiates) have debilitating addictive character and voluminous side-effects. This is a challenge modern medicine needs to factor in and find solutions for. Sugar does it for me, induce sleep! A few beers or cups of red wine will have me snoring in my Siesta. I get to enjoy the youth of my kids now by using their level of curiosity, their colognes, music and clothes (my son's I mean).

But your fundamental point regarding relationship of sleep, medication (herbal or otherwise), diet etc. is certainly a subject that deserves more research if not done already.

Ginger doesn't seem to have any adverse action on my sleep pattern but certainly an amelioration for my wife since I seem to snore less. Partner's snoring probably affect more spouse sleep patterns than any medication or herbal treatment, in my un-trained un-scientific humble opinion.

Dear friends, I place some info about Ginger flower. Wonderful fragrance, taste and removes bloatedness and wind in the tummy :))

Etlingera elatior (also known as Torch Ginger, Ginger Flower, Red Ginger Lily, Torch Lily, Wild Ginger, Combrang, Bunga Kantan, Philippine Wax Flower, Xiang Bao Jiaing, Indonesian Tall Ginger, Boca de Dragón, Rose de Porcelaine, Porcelain Rose) is a species of herbaceous perennial plant[citation needed]. Botanical synonyms include Nicolaia elatior,[1] Phaeomeria magnifica,[1] Nicolaia speciosa, Phaeomeria speciosa, Alpinia elatior, Alpinia magnifica.

The flower buds are an important ingredient in the Nonya dish laksa. In North Sumatra, the flower buds are used for a dish called arsik ikan mas (Andaliman/Szechuan pepper Spiced Carp)

It is known in Indonesian as bunga kecombrang or honje, Malay as bunga kantan and Thai as ดาหลา daalaa. In Thailand it is eaten in a kind of Thai salad preparation.[2]

Friends, here is some info on Winter melon. For treating edema leg swelling and constipation.

'The winter melon diet gives you added nutrition you need to succeed in your diet while being low in calories. The healthy benefits of this exotic food often found in tea and oriental soup.'

Thanks Patrick :))

I will come back soon. After 5 pm, I have a meeting with my Deputy Director about PPSMI (Malay Acronym for teaching Sc and Math in English). Lots of work, then I will come back to YOU ALL :))

Well, in some parts of non-oriental world there are also persons, refusing chemical medication. I think, this is induced by a feeling of desperation, as medicine often is losing battle with certain diseases (cancer).

And as for the sleep pattern. I myself had years of slepp as short as 3-5 hours per night in very long period, when started teaching. once a month, or once in two months I slept two days, with a short breaks. such pattern took maybe 5-7 years. Now I cannot do this. This was adrenalin forst, then habit later. One of my colleagues also is having such sleep pattern right now. I do not think this is benefitial, but also is not a disaster.

@Linas, et al., Sorry. Now 20.51, I just come back to this thread. (My time zone is GMT+800.)

Yes, friends, it's not wise to deprive the body of rest and sleep. Do you have winter melon in US? Some places in China are still warm enough for this gourd. The main aim is to hydrate, so we call it cooling (yin), cleanse the body of toxins, provide fibre, some vitamins and minerals. Perhaps, pumpkin soup will be just as good :)

No, native water melon is absent, we have these only in shops, brought from south. Pumpkins and tzukini (zuchini? ) are growing well.

Linas et al., actually I'm very thankful that I can still use these herbal cures. Who knows, one of these days, if we live long enough, we may need the medicine produced by Big Pharma? Because we are not meant to be forever young and vibrant, let's also be prepared to age gracefully...

Miranda, I thought I'd menton that most medicines coming out from Big Pharma have herbal and some homeopathic medicines as their "idea-templates". The reason of couse is money--they can patent the synthetics. But, as a former professor of pharmacology, in truth here are my studied observations:

1) The synthetics leave off the co-factors and peripheral components that moderate the effects of the herbal medications, although we must admit there are huge variations in bioavailability and quality control in herbal versus synthetics. But the co-factors and "live elements" in the herbal are what allow the body to throw off unnecessary quantities and to more readily accept beneficial components without adverse effects.

2) Herbals can be patented in terms of delivery systems (enteric, sublingual, short-chained modification, time release, etc.). The main obstacle in taking herbal and organic is bioavailability--we need better measures so we can demonstrate efficacy. In that arena synthetics, though side/interaction/withdrawal effect-laden, excel over herbals and organics.

3. Many government healthcare systems have recently been persuaded via relentless campaigns to embrace pharmaceuticals instead of continuing their campaigns to get their population healthy (by stopping smoking, alcohol, eating more organically, etc.). Ignoring the underlying causes of public health problems is a grave and expensive mistake. Medications should not be used a band-aid to mask symptoms of chronic disease, but instead for acute disease only.

4. The above state of affairs has forced more and more informed health conscious individuals to fend for themselves, finding them juxtaposed to an adversarial healthcare system that would have them abandon their healthier lifestyle in favor of going to the pharma-approach. Otherwise, they are paying high taxes to support a system of which they are not participating. We have that problem in the US, where now 71% of all healthcare is government managed healthcare. This forces millions of us to pay high taxes for something we are not using. A con game if there ever was one.

Hopefully, informed people will change lifestyle, diet, hydration, etc. in spite of the economic dynamics and not succumb to the current schematas that are trapping the masses into a sick-care system. If they will apply the dictum that medications are best used on a temporary basis until underlying causes are found and addressed, then stopped, they will avoid the pitfalls of current trends in chronic disease and find themselves among the healthiest of the healthy and living longer, more fulfilling lives.

Thanks Dr Max, for your wonderful answer :)

I've just finished my work for today. Surely reading this is a great reward for a hard day's work :))

I actually stopped drinking coffee, although I like it. Tea is less dehydrating! When I get aware of less healthy practices, I must change for the better.

Dear friends, this link gives info on herbal medicine in my country :)

"The Herbal Medicine Research Centre (HMRC) was established in 2001 to provide scientific evidence for the efficacy and safety of herbal products. Since a variety of plant species has been reported to have medicinal values, it is appropriate that the HMRC be the repository for information on such species in the country."

Good reading.

http://www.imr.gov.my/en/hmrc.html

Dear Miranda

Check this interesting link:

https://www.researchgate.net/post/Traditional_medicine_users_which_group_of_patients_gain_more2#55095ae8d685cc7d778b4569