From 1987 WCED report to 2022 COP27 emission have gone up despite the sustainable development push, the Kyoto protocol, the original millennium development goals, the Paris Agreement, the new development goals, all COP processes…..
The only thing missing all those years are green markets to transition from the dirty economy to the clean economy, which could have been set up as a result of 2012 Rio + 20 conferences(UNCSD), but they were not set up…as the world decided to go the environmental pollution management way….
And this raises the question; Can we transition from the environmentally dirty economy to the environmentally clean economy without green markets?
I think No, what do you think? Why do you think so?
Short answers are the best to exchange ideas.
Yes, it is possible to transition to a clean economy without green markets. The key to achieving this is to implement a combination of policies, regulations, and incentives that are effective in promoting the transition. These can include taxes and subsidies on emissions, setting up targets and standards for emissions and fuel efficiency, investing in renewable energy sources, and establishing incentives to encourage businesses and households to switch to cleaner energy sources. Additionally, educating the public on the importance of transitioning to a clean economy and the benefits associated with it is essential in achieving the desired result.
It is possible to transition from an environmentally dirty economy to an environmentally clean economy without relying solely on green markets. Green markets, which refer to the buying and selling of goods and services that are environmentally friendly or sustainable, can certainly play a role in promoting the transition to a cleaner economy. However, there are other policy and regulatory approaches that can also be effective in driving the transition to a more environmentally friendly economy.
For example, governments can implement policies and regulations that encourage or require businesses to adopt cleaner technologies and practices. These can include measures such as carbon pricing, fuel efficiency standards, and renewable energy incentives. Governments can also invest in research and development to support the development of cleaner technologies and practices.
Additionally, there are other ways that individuals and communities can contribute to the transition to a cleaner economy, even if they are not participating in green markets. For example, individuals can reduce their own environmental impacts by making environmentally friendly choices in their daily lives, such as using energy-efficient appliances and reducing their use of single-use plastics. Communities can also work together to advocate for cleaner policies and practices at the local and national levels.
Overall, the transition to a cleaner economy will likely involve a combination of approaches, including both green markets and other policy and regulatory measures.
Peter and Neeraj, good day! Did you read the context on which this question is based so you can take it into consideration before trying to answer? Here is below again:
"From 1987 WCED report to 2022 COP27 emission have gone up despite the sustainable development push, the Kyoto protocol, the original millennium development goals, the Paris Agreement, the new development goals, all COP processes…..
The only thing missing all those years are green markets to transition from the dirty economy to the clean economy, which could have been set up as a result of 2012 Rio + 20 conferences(UNCSD), but they were not set up…as the world decided to go the environmental pollution management way….'"
Since 1987 to COP27 2022 we have tried different forms of DWARF GREEN MARKETS and emission still increased, which means that even under environmental pollution management since 2012 emissions have increased....That is about 35 years of avoiding setting up green markets....And a world that lives still in a dirty economy but under profitable pollution management that gives the illusion of environmental friendliness there is no incentive or rush to transition to an environmentally clean economy.....
Peter and Neeraj, do you know the difference between green markets and dwarf green markets in terms of the nature of their model structure, the nature of their market price structure, the nature of consumers and producers, the role of taxes, and the role of pollution reduction as a profit making incentive? If Yes, then should see that one of then is a path to the environmentally clean economy and the other is a BLOCK.
If you do know those differences, then you can not see the BLOCK, then that explain your answer of Yes to a situation science says it is No.
Thank you for commenting Peter and Neeraj.
Respectfully yours;
Lucio
Dear Lucio, Good day! I have taken my time to read the context on which this question is based and taken it into consideration. Upon a second look, Significantly, I think the answer is "No", it is not possible to transition from an environmentally dirty economy to an environmentally clean economy without green markets. Green markets are essential for creating incentives for businesses and individuals to transition to a cleaner economy. They provide financial rewards for reducing emissions and developing cleaner technologies, and they create a price signal that encourages businesses and individuals to invest in cleaner technologies. Furthermore, green markets help to create a level playing field between polluters and those who are investing in cleaner technologies. Without green markets, it is difficult to incentivize businesses and individuals to transition to an environmentally clean economy. Well appreciated. Warm regards, Peter
Peter, that is the right thinking.
In green markets once set up pollution reduction becomes a profit making opportunity which drives the closing of the renewable energy technology gap on its aim to produce at the lowest green market price possible/lowest environmentally cost possible trending in the long term towards the environmentally clean economy.
As green market production and consumption expands you are producing less and less pollution base products at a lower and lower green market price.
Thank you for taking the time to comment.
Lucio
Hence Peter, without green markets the transition path to the environmentally clean economy is BLOCKED.
No, you are correct in my opinion Lucio. Too many uninformed people suffer from myopia and have learned by reward to externalize negative effects immediately. Not sufficient Adam Smith caliber of people around - more the George W. Bush guys. Things would be different by now if Al Gore had won the election.
Green markets alone will not be enough. We are far too sticky with our entire wrong behavior. People simply do not adapt and follow Average Joe, unfortunately. Chaps like us who care about this issue are burned in public by the sticky majority.
Dear Lucio, Thank you for your perspective. However, I would like to reiterate that the angle from where I see this question is based on the socio-political perspective wherein strategies and policies including regulatory approaches will equally play a major role to actually create the green market about which you have also rightly highlighted.
Warm regards
Neeraj
Neeraj, good day. Setting up green markets needs a change in the culture of consumers and producers, in the culture fo population dynamics, in the culture of policies incentives and desinsentives and politicians, in the culture of university and schools, and we need to think using green micricroeconomis and green macroeconomic thinking here as traditional economic thinking does not work in green markets.
Thank you for commenting Neeraj!
Hello, I would like to thank you for raising this very important and vital question for the world community.
I strongly agree with your point of view. I hope I can play a role at this stage and to overcome this problem.
If there are effective conferences and gatherings in this regard, please let me know. (Email address: [email protected] and website address: http://dralimohammadipour.blog.ir/)
Dear Ali, thank you for writing. In the case of the environmental issue mainstream development thinkers can see that at the heart of the environmental issue is the FACT that there is an envirornmental pollution problem separating the environmentally dirty economy(Traditional market) and the environmentally clean economy, a problem that is embedded in the environmentally distorted market pricing mechanism of the traditional market.... a problem that can only be corrected using perfect green market thinking and environmental cost internalization as this is an environmental sustainability problem...
Brundtland Commission in 1987 mistook a sustainability issue as a sustainable development issue and recommended sustainable development solutions, emission continue to increase...
The kyoto protocol 1997 came and went, emissions continue to increase,,,
Millenium development goals came and went, emissions continue to increase,,,,
The RIO + 20 2012 conference came and went, emissions continue to increase....
Low carbon, cap and trade, carbon pricing, net zero,,,,, emissions continue to increase....
Paris agreement came 2015 with sustainable development goals, emissions continue to increase...
A series of COP processes including COP27 in 2022 came and went, emissions continue to increase
All of them have failed in taming emissions because none of them is an environmental pollution reduction market and all of them are different forms of environmental pollution management markets unconnected to the goal raised by the need to transition as soon as possible away from the environmentally dirty economy to the environmentally clean economy.
The ideas you agree with are the ideas the world has been avoiding to take up when implementing dwarf green markets a la environmental pollution management, markets not cleared by green market prices and by the interaction of green producers and green consumers and markets not supported by or inconsistent with green micro-economic and green macro-economic thinking,,,
Ali, you may find the following article interesting, full of food for thoughts
Sustainability thoughts 139: How can the 2012 road to transition from environmental pollution based traditional economies to the environmentally clean economies that the world never built be pointed out?
Article Sustainability thoughts 139: How can the 2012 road to transi...
Have a nice day
Lucio
It is important to understand what the drivers of INDIVIDUAL behavioural change. We have conducted an extensive research project about this, and found that most marketing campaigns (public sector or "green" products/brands) are not engaging some fundamental aspects for change, such as emotions or moral norms.
You can check our actionable framework available at:
Article The PSICHE framework for sustainable consumption and future ...
Moreover, the green premium prices (a condition of low economies of scale and early stages of technology/expertise lifecycle) are a major barrier. Green marketing of brands can influence that, but ONLY when brands resonate with consumers' lifestyles, as demonstrated here:
Article How to earn a premium price: the effect of green marketing a...
This is meaningful to understand that public policies and green market development must capture the fundamental socialization and "coolness"/lifestyle issues to ensure that change occurs, even for low-environmentally consciousness individuals/organisations, and for not socially visible situations.
Dear Jorge, thank you for taking the time to write. You did not try to answer the question and use your comment to support your answer.
About your comment:
There is a need for theory-practice consistency when talking about market price signals at the micro level or macro level to drive consistent market behavior. If you are in the traditional market world of Adam Smith then you follow the signals of the traditional market price. If you are in the green market world then you follow the green market price signal. If you are in the dwarf green market world, then you follow the pollution management market price signal. Since there are no green markets and you are talking about environmentally friendliness I assume your comment is about the working of dwarf green markets.
However, the question here is: Can we transition from the environmentally dirty economy to the environmentally clean economy without green markets?
Which can be rewritten as to make it consistent with your comment: Can we transition from the environmentally dirty economy to the environmentally clean economy with the use of dwarf green markets?.
The answer to both questions is No.
You may find the following papers informative with good food for thoughts with respect to the why.
Sustainability thought 162: Can we transition from the environmentally dirty economy to the environmental clean economy with the use of dwarf green markets? If no, why not?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/367498814_Sustainability_thought_162_Can_we_transition_from_the_environmentally_dirty_economy_to_the_environmental_clean_economy_with_the_use_of_dwarf_green_markets_If_no_why_not?_sg%5B0%5D=UzQWfHxEpBZOxaPlTUZgaTYbkAw22PKy7QI2I3JefrV94g0P_qcW0aJxbFtVV0WyFcl7zNlxmmXrjOd5lx2mrzihZ2Pu51H8tAotleJ7.VRaw-5yTzkl3mH9cfEbjbRcdWSSdC16YQCc3LGg_qHLKJZ_R1Ld0sGz83xC6PfaONzMFz89y2609fzr-08MKsA
Sustainability thoughts 140: How can the consequences of the 2012 green market paradigm shift avoidance move that led to the world of dwarf green markets of today be highlighted, including the green Marxism threat?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/364690964_Sustainability_thoughts_140_How_can_the_consequences_of_the_2012_green_market_paradigm_shift_avoidance_move_that_led_to_the_world_of_dwarf_green_markets_of_today_be_highlighted_including_the_green_Mar
Sustainability thoughts 139: How can the 2012 road to transition from environmental pollution based traditional economies to the environmentally clean economies that the world never built be pointed out?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363670571_Sustainability_thoughts_139_How_can_the_2012_road_to_transition_from_environmental_pollution_based_traditional_economies_to_the_environmentally_clean_economies_that_the_world_never_built_be_pointed_ou?_sg%5B0%5D=mYt0fDTZ_zh10KmLj_kYESLv-ch11xebAQl9fzPvuM0-7ZN_cqcxLxs4BsL7AjDMA7L55NvGRQcGQ2_J_OXjdAK8wPurXcp3bUPAF4Wo.XLxvIsUHVSYR6AmdTHG78LrAOV8PWwCfxA-VHswNDSn6zMWtved__B6XrHd6Oyq1IgpwaN-XWkKW2jKrmWMEew
Sustainability thought 170: What happens to the Thomas Kuhn’s paradigm evolution loop under willful academic blindness? What are the implications of this?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/362566384_Sustainability_thought_170_What_happens_to_the_Thomas_Kuhn's_paradigm_evolution_loop_under_willful_academic_blindness_What_are_the_implications_of_this?_sg%5B0%5D=6I60vH2OqyqRm25_Ua78xR2As1WeI-5DxGFXy-CP5OA37e_jVofpg8RdVuDnsI0_WN7wVHJNOG5EACQkwGGIYS5o72rJ4OpkrhVblB3d.KBi7z2H_FOz_b2hLlxiRbeIc5Sm29tDB9UGTrNOUGRr4zFtrQvLGUkkdE2bYgOL4FrF_BJmCJw6KOHWfjO-wnA
Sustainability thoughts 130: Can green economies and green growth exist without green markets? If not, why not? What is the current main development implication of this?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/346438700_Sustainability_thoughts_130_Can_green_economies_and_green_growth_exist_without_green_markets_If_not_why_not_What_is_the_current_main_development_implication_of_this
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