Dear Javier,

I used to do the First Beat Quick Recovery test at the same moment of the ck blood sample (37 - 48h post match), but the results are still inconclusive in elite soccer players. Therefore, i think the HRV is a usefool tool to quantify traning load in soccer players.

Regards!

Hi, Andre. We used to get CK sample from blood at the same time of HRV, 48 hs after match. We think that CK values are unipersonal meaning to use as biomarker, so trying to get samples several times it will be there a background for each player. In the other hand, HRV give unipersonal data but when you get some ratios as LF/HF in supine and tilt positions it is possible to unify a criteria to take into account to every player. I've send a paper to a journal with this data, may be we can share this information soon! 

Best Regards.

Is too variable.

The most sensitive HRV índices with training load variations are Vagal-mediated like RMSS, SD1, spectral parameters (LF ms2 or ln and LF ms2 or ln). The LF/HF ratio is very variable. You can to measure HRV daily or weekly. Daily is better, but athletes become bored doing the HRV assessments every morning. See this paper. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23852425

Of course we've red the studies from Plews and Yann Le Meur (Evidence of Parasympathetic Hyperactivity in Functionally Overreached Athletes). They worked with that variables (RMSSD) in daily samples. We started to work mesuring  monthly and then weekly with soccer players and high performance athletes. Daily is complicated and as you say become to be boring and difficult to perform.  

Regarding LF/HF ratio, sure its 's variable as other parameters from HRV, more if you measure it in only one position. We are working with two positions (supine and tilt) and the relations between LF/HF ratios between this positions (Final LF/HF r) could be important to get information about sympatho -  vagal balance. We are working in a new manuscript, but you can see in one paper from my profile the method that we started to work from 2010. 

In the other hand, you can relate HRV with others biomarkers as CK or Testosterone/Cortisol ratio. Also with different fatigue or OR/OT diagnostics. Always, it's better to find and relate several parameters at the same time. Of course, we are working in this way and we'll see in a future the real answer. 

Thank you Jose and Lucio for your answer. 

Regards, 

Javier V.

Hi there,

I agree with Lucio. I also found SD1 as a good marker of training load. Concerning the obtrusiveness of the HRV measure, there will be soon solutions to make HRV monitoring very convenient. Like, at the moment, you can see for optical HR monitoring.

Best,

Francesco 

Thanks Francesco for your answer. One question: Did you measure HRV in both positions? I mean supine and tilt. In this way you can get more interesting information.

Yes I did and I agree. However I understand that right now the HR/HRV monitors are not very user friendly. This will improve soon with the PPG technology.

OK, but there are so many studies in the literature validating these monitors. For instance:

- Gamelin F, Berthoin S, Bosquet L. Validity of the polar S810 heart rate monitor to measure R-R intervals at rest. Med. Sci. Sports Exerc. 2006;38:887-893.

- Parrado E, García M, Ramos J, Cervantes J, Rodas G, Capdevila L. Comparison of Omega Wave System and Polar S810i to detect R-R intervals at rest. Int. J. Sports Med. 2010;31(5):336-341.

- Vanderlei L, Silva R, Pastre C, Azevedo F, Godoy M. Comparison of the Polar S810i monitor and the ECG for the analysis of heart rate variability in the time and frequency domains. Braz. J. Med. Biol. Res. 2008;41:854-859.

I agree with you I also use/used either ECG or polar, which can gather IBIs. PPG based HRV devices need still validation, but I am very confident they will reveal very versatile. Let me know if you are interested in this probably for a collaboration.

OK Francesco. Where could I get information from PPG technology?

About LF, HF and LF/HF ratio, check these results from Leti T and Bricout V:

The HRV indices (heart rate, LF (n.u.), HF (n.u.) and LF/HF) were significantly altered with the competitive impact, shifting toward a sympathetic predominance. After rest and recovery nights, the LF (n.u.) increased significantly with the competitive impact (62.1±15.2 and 66.9±11.6 vs. 76.0±10.7; p

Daniel J Plews suggested:

Have a read of Al Haddad et al 2011 (IJSM) for more on the reliability of HRV indices.

An Interesting study from Laurent Schmitt (Plos 2013) to take into account:

Fatigue Shifts and Scatters Heart Rate Variability in Elite Endurance Athletes

"All the frequency band descriptors were lowered in fatigue state. In supine position, the power decrease was lesser in LF than HF, leading to a higher LF/HF ratio and suggesting a less parasympathetic control on HR. The changes in LFnu and HFnu also displayed this pattern. The simultaneous decrease of total spectral power and the larger contribution of LF variability were thus in line with previous reports in fatigue after competition OR or OT"

Yes, this paper is quite interesting

We insist in this index (LF/HF r in supine and tilt position) to quantify autonomic imbalance in fatigue state and non functional OR. We are getting some conclusions from a case study in NF-OR state comparing data with control group (7 players from same team but normal performance during season). Article coming soon….

Bojan,

Those are excellent references to have into account. I mentioned before the study from Al Haddad and Daniel Plews suggested this article to have a better understanding about reliability of HRV indices. I think that HRV is a topic that need more studies in specifics fields: High performance is not easy to have data during a long time. We will see in a future if just indexes as RMSSD can qualify autonomic imbalance or others as LF/HF ratios.

Thanks

Thank u Bojan i appreciate it!