There are a lot of researchers that have trouble like this. Please tell me your experiences and your efforts with this or introduce some references.
Dear Reza,
Based on my experience, personal and through my students,
two are the fundamental problems: writing attractively
in your native language and writing correctly in a second
language. The former is, in my opinion, a much bigger
problem than the latter, a problem that is often unrecognized.
It is essential to be able to write attractively in your
native tongue to be able to communicate (whatever message)
effectively. People should be interested in what you're
writing, starting from the title, and enthralled to
read the entire article. If your prose is boring or
without a logic in your own tongue, it'll be even more
boring and without logic in a second language. Remember
that: "Clear Writing Means Clear Thinking".
If you can write attractively in your own tongue, you
can write attractively in any second language. It's only matter
(I know it sounds pretentious) to study the grammar and the
syntax of the second language, but that's all there is, really.
It is matter of practice. You should write often and re-read
critically what you wrote: if you don't like what you wrote,
probably nobody will.
The book (suggested by Carlos Driemeier) "The Elements of
Style" by Strunk and White, aside from being very helpful,
is an excellent example of how one can write attractively
about a subject that could sound boring.
Best wishes,
Luca
-----------------------------------------------------
Prof. Luca Cortelezzi
Department of Mechanical Engineering
McGill University
http://people.mcgill.ca/luca.cortelezzi/
Consider the story first in your mother language, then write it in paper and then translate it into english. Later, based on you referring english papers, revise it more and more.
I would suggest to start with basic sentences to create the story. Once you obtain a smooth transition between the chapters, you can revise it with the more complex sentences.
The best idea I can give is to think in the language you wish to write in. That will take care of grammar, provided you know it first-hand.
I would suggest you to create a small group of young scientists that can meet every day, for example for half an hour or more. Try to explain each other your knowledge, experiences etc. in English no matter on what topic - firstly for yourself, then for your families, relations, friends etc. After some time try to read aloud a part of or entire scientific paper and to explain again aloud and in English what you've understood. And of course, as Georgios Varsos suggested: read read read read and read.
I wish you success.
as of now many people outsource their work to publish ...to some English teachers
further .... you tube is also now a days very useful .. to know more about the research works... even we can prefer a separate social website which includes videos and images and even ppt
Hello all,
Nice question - well, suggestions are great - but no matter what you do you will continue to be a writer in second language or even sometimes in third or fourth languages - and if they do not know it from your writing (you were that great) - they will spot your surname and start searching for simple errors to prove that you cannot write!?
But, do not give up - keep on trying - write, edit and re-edit - use editors' services - and always read good articles - you learn from these! high impact journals.
Regards
Theodora Issa
This is a great free online course that can help you develop your skills:
https://www.coursera.org/course/sciwrite
On a more general and long-term perspective, I think that regular (passive) exposure to spoken English helps as well. This might include high-quality podcasts by native speakers or audiobooks. (I've been listening to the audio edition of The Economist for several years now.)
Hello Chris, Thais and Peter,
Thank you for your contributions - indeed 'the native speaker' - no matter what is done by those who have English as their second or third languages - even at the Professorship level, they will continue to feel they cannot perfect it... well, though they aim for perfection! but it is difficult for them!?
The stanford link is good.
Yes, regular exposure to spoken English is great... ---
Thanks and regards
Theodora Issa
Thank you for your good Replying, especially Dear Theodora Thais , Margarita and Peter,
as Theodora said Stanford link is very good and i suggest visit this page,Thank Thais again.
Dear Theodora , you said fact about those who have English as their second or third languages.Perfection, Perfection, Perfection!
Best Regards,
Reza
In my opinion, improving your writing by studying the book "Writers at Work" besides reading English-language articles might be really helpful.
Try publishing in the English speaking world in 90 percent rejction rate journals. All comments sent to you are the feedback you need to imporove your writing for scientific purposes. In terms of bad comments, we shouldn't take them to heart. It is not personal indeed. but a great opportunity to learn.
thank Jose ,but what is rejction rate journals? ;) , those journals that fastly reject our article?
Thanks Jane for the new link...
Thanks Amir for the 'Writers at work'...
Well Reza as for rejections, there are two types - one would be referred to as 'desk rejection' where the editor without sending to any reviewers would reject the paper... then you have the other rejection which would be after receiving the reviewers comments - and usually the editor would go with the most negative of all reviewers!!!
Regards
Theodora Issa
... And if your research is in Biomedical Engineering, please come spend some time in my lab in England ;-)
I think that there are a number of possibilities that can help you master the English language,
Either using lexicons, but technical either by exercising with English colleagues, the better it is to take and be diligent!
Thanks Mian for the attachment - interesting...
Great invitation Fernando
Indeed Tayeb it is being DILIGENT that would be the key! Practice Practice Practice ! might be the answer ... but might not lead into perfection.
Regards
Theodora Issa
Dear Fernando
it's good idea, but i'm Energy Engineer, Thank you for your invitation ;)
Practice with good coaching and in the right environment will lead to perfection, Theodora Issa.
Practice, pratice and more practice.
On the other hand, I think all starts with reading. Try this website:
http://www.readtheory.org/
Free registration!
Dear Reza
I think that reading articles and surfing sites about your field might help plus you gotta start self study of your second language whenever you got time.
good luck.
The book "The Elements of Style" by Strunk and White is a classic and very helpful.
Often I tell my students than the best way is to write papers with other people, even if also non-native speakers... by seeing the corrections they will make on your text you will slowly improve!
I wanna improve my writing skill (pariculary academic writing) by studying the book "writers at work". How is that? Is it appropriate for the purpose? I really appreciate if anyone tell me his/her experiece about the book.
Learning academic english is better . But practise the language with people is necessary!
The course "Writing in the Sciences" from Stanford is really useful. Thank you Thais.
No 1, read some quality books.....lots of them (written word)
No 2, listen to the BBC ( radio 3 and radio 4) online (spoken word)
No 3, practice, practice, practice.
I am afraid reading advice books will not help much, reading quality writers and learning from them does.
Good luck
pete
Thanks Peter
but what is quality books?they are special books or something else?
No, just classics such as Dickens, Hugo, fitzgerald,DuMaurier, Hardy is a must (my favourite author), and modern classics such as Mantel and the list of booker prize winners. They will all have Use of English at the highest level and will make the learning more pleasurable. Furthermore, the process will make you more scholarly too.
Another lesson, keep your sentences short. When you have improved go for longer senteces; maybe you could fit in a semi-colon.
good luck
pete
Dear Reza,
Based on my experience, personal and through my students,
two are the fundamental problems: writing attractively
in your native language and writing correctly in a second
language. The former is, in my opinion, a much bigger
problem than the latter, a problem that is often unrecognized.
It is essential to be able to write attractively in your
native tongue to be able to communicate (whatever message)
effectively. People should be interested in what you're
writing, starting from the title, and enthralled to
read the entire article. If your prose is boring or
without a logic in your own tongue, it'll be even more
boring and without logic in a second language. Remember
that: "Clear Writing Means Clear Thinking".
If you can write attractively in your own tongue, you
can write attractively in any second language. It's only matter
(I know it sounds pretentious) to study the grammar and the
syntax of the second language, but that's all there is, really.
It is matter of practice. You should write often and re-read
critically what you wrote: if you don't like what you wrote,
probably nobody will.
The book (suggested by Carlos Driemeier) "The Elements of
Style" by Strunk and White, aside from being very helpful,
is an excellent example of how one can write attractively
about a subject that could sound boring.
Best wishes,
Luca
-----------------------------------------------------
Prof. Luca Cortelezzi
Department of Mechanical Engineering
McGill University
http://people.mcgill.ca/luca.cortelezzi/
I've found a book ; "Science Research Writing" For non-native speakers of English By Hilary Glasman-Deal, it should be the good book for those who want to write journal paper
For Non English native researcher to be able to write in the scientific community, I think it is very important to use professional English translators to them to improve their write up before submitting papers. From experience, a paper could be rejected due to poor English, so it is important to seek help.
My mother tongue is Spanish, and I use both English and Portuguese in a scientific environment. Rather than an advise, this is only my approach to address this issue, and I have to say I still have a lot to learn. So far, I didn’t find any shortcut: in order to master writing scientific texts in another language, as in any other subject, I need continuous studying and training. That's why, after reading articles very frequently, I’m probably better at reading skills than at writing or at oral communication skills. I have learned trying to read carefully articles written by English natives, not only looking for the science, but also noting the way they write, their expressions and style. But to improve my writing I need to write. The exercises for writing essays you can find in any course aimed to pass technical IELTS tests, which are based on the familiar interpretation of charts and graphics, were a good start for this. I still do this from time to time with some graphic of my interest, and have the text revised by one of my English speaking friends. I also try to take notes, write texts and actually try to “think” in the language I’m using at the moment. Finally, to write in my mother tongue and translate afterwards always proved to be a very bad idea. I hope this is helpful.
I come from India with my native tongue being Telugu. In order to get the necessary proficiency is first need to have thorough grounding of the English language in terms of its grammar, vocabulary, idioms, etc. This is first obtained by formal training such as in a school or through some English language training programs such as those offered British Council. That is the first part which probably is relatively easy to achieve. This gives the basics, but the mastery will come only when you start practicing it.
For practicing, it is necessary to read through good books, watch movies (to get a better pronunciation – For UK many BBC movies; for USA may be Hollywood movies), read through newspapers. Along with the reading you also need to practice the writing skills. Try to take any passage from a good book and try to convert that into your own language and vice versa to get some feel for the language. If you have access to a learned English person get him/her to do the necessary corrections to know what mistakes you are making so that you will improve the next time. In fact you have to do a lot of reading and writing before you can get the mastery. I don’t think there is any short cut.
SciWrite: Writing in the Sciences
Stanford University
https://class.stanford.edu/courses/Medicine/SciWrite/Fall2013/about
Edit:
Its YouTube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-wb-n89yM0lBiP2QltsDaA
I would like to add a statement:
The standards for languages like C1 and C2 for technical persons are too high today,
one should remain on B2. One will loose qualified scientists in this way and replace them with theoretical linguists. English should remain a communication language among scientists. It should remain pleasant to communicate technical and scientific matter.
What is wrong if someone writes "conclusions made" instead of "conclusions drawn"? The verb "made" is definitely wrong for linguists, but everybody understands it and 25% of world uses "conclusions made".
I recommend you to enrole one of the courses on "Writing in English" like those in Coursera, Standford University ( SciWrite Writing in the Sciences) , etc. They are very interesting and not boring at all.
All the best.
Reading english literature and listenng to english tv shows help getting uses to the language. Doing an english course helps you understand the grammar. However the most efective way is to go abroad, in particular to an native english speaking country.
For researchers, in most case, they need write in a style called Academic Writing which will be different to the articles in TV shows and newspapers.
Read more journal papers and more practice will help
For youngers researchers: Say; YES I CAN, YES I CAN,..................................
Dear Reza
I can understand that this is indeed a serious problem with non-english-speaking people. I teach a course in a top university in Denmark. While evaluating the answer-books, I discover that while the students speak quite impressively, but are not so good at writing. I found most of them brilliant though. But I noticed that those students who have attended courses in environments that are English-speaking countries, did better in writing. I would say that beside other efforts, such students should try the following:
1. If possible, study some courses from English-speaking universities.
2. Regularly read the editorial of two English magazines: 'Economist' and 'Time'. I found in them the best written English that anyone can understand, and also it is enjoyable to read these editorials.
3. Try to befriend someone who is from an English-speaking atmosphere, and interact with her/him regularly. You will learn faster, and will be able to learn things more effectively.
4. Build your on agenda as to how you can improve; each person is different. One should know one's strengths and limitations, and interests and aversions. base your agenda on these.
Hope these help and facilitate English writing better and more expeditiously.
I think Luca has made a very important point. One must focus on writing attractively. There can not be any two different opinions on that. What all you write should attract people who are your audience. This necessitates efforts, and reading and re-reading what you have written. Every time you re-read, you would like to make alterations. Keep doing that till you are fully satisfied that you have done your best, This would be of immense help. i read all I write at least 15 times or more while I making corrections in the initial draft.
Thanks Luca for making this point.
Does it really matter in the case of writing research articles? If at all there are grammar mistakes, I feel that should be rectified by the editor. A research article should not be rejected purely on the basis of language because scientific papers are not works of literature.
There is an initiative here on RG to help improve ESL writing. Please contribute to
https://www.researchgate.net/post/Anyone_interested_in_participating_in_an_ESL_Mentoring_Network
and in case of questions tag your post with 'ESL Mentoring'.
All this is perfect from a view point of a linguist.
Indeed, a scientist should be clearly understood for sure.
Often this is even not the case in oral communications of native speakers.
I know internatinal tutorials where native speakers are simply not preferred as their diction is not good, and may mix local accents.
Other skills such as a practical mind to realise things and knowledge of other scientific areas are also important for scientists. Even some business aspects. So if we need to put 20% of our time in language improvement, it will be definitely at the expense of other skills and human relationships. It can even sooner or later result in a burn-out.
Science should be something nice to do, nice to communicate and be relevant for the society.
You could try reading my book: Secrets of writing killer essays & reports. It is available from Amazon.com.
Cheers, Don
Have a look at REF-N-WRITE scientific paper writing tool. This tool allows you to import text from previous papers relevant to the subject area in MS word. While you are writing your paper, you can just search for similar statements from other authors and inherit their vocabulary and language to improve your paper. It also comes with a library of academic phrases that you can readily use to polish your paper. Here is the link for the site.
http://www.ref-n-write.com
They have some nice tutorials here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qf7qyyKtbyQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6hlXzqO3r4
I think by reading good papers and books written in your area of research may help you enormously. In addition you can get help from your peers who are good in writing. Hope there is no ready made cook book formula to develop the skill of writing.
My mother tongue is Telugu,
my School education is entirely done in Telugu
Still Today I speak fluent English and write articles in good, meaningful English and even write poetry in English
It all depends on the efforts you put to learn the language
I use to Read a lot, specially News Papers...watch English movies....
Try to remember and reuse some good words you have read/heard
Practice makes a person perfect in anything....including language.
Yes, it does really matter. Research articles are commonly rejected purely on the basis of language and yes, they should be and will be rejected on this basis.
There is no success without hard work. While trying to write good English for effective communication by learning from the native English speakers, make friend with some of them . In doing this, you can always request them to go through your write up for proofreading before sending them out to the journal you consider for publication.
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