There’s no need for any observer. The wavefunction is a means to an end, the calculation of the probability distribution, in the case at hand, of the spacetime geometry, when quantum fluctuations are relevant. The problem is that how to sample over spacetime geometries, that don’t satisfy Einstein’s equations isn’t known.

Question: "Is the mechanism of human consciousness, in its most fundamental form, based on the laws of fundamental particles that can interact with the world around it?"

No. it is based on the properties of the 6-layer neural network of the neocortex.

Article Advancement on the Mechanics of Conceptual Thinking (Republication PI)

Dear Andre Michaud;

What I mean by raising this question in the discussion is to understand at what level human consciousness has the possibility of interaction and influence on the laws and quantum functions of fundamental, atomic and subatomic particles?

Dear Seyed Mohammad Mousavi

Interesting question indeed.

From what I observed, the possibility that we have with regard to the natural laws that atomic and subatomic particles are subjected to, is to discover them by reverse engineering from the observable characteristics that our instruments and experiments allow us to establish, not really to "influence" them, given that it can be surmised that they are out of our control to modify.

Once correctly established however, they can be used to our benefit, as was done with the now well understood electromagnetic properties that underlie most of our modern communication technology for example.

Best Regards, André

“…Many theoretical physicists mention the cosmic wave function,….”

- yeah, that is indeed so, despite that really nobody of theoretical physicists till now cannot to write a reasonable wave function even for atoms with a few electrons, but the “universe wave functions” in mainstream physics exist…

“…There’s no need for any observer. The wavefunction is a means to an end, the calculation of the probability distribution, in the case at hand, of the spacetime geometry, when quantum fluctuations are relevant….”

- really QM works only with QM scale material objects – particles, atoms, molecules, compositions of “macro” QM objects at ultralow temperatures, etc., while all that exists and happens in mainstream QM only in the flat [mathematically] imaginary Minkowski space –

- what is correct in principle; and, though is fundamentally incorrect in that real utmost universal Matter’s spacetime is the fundamentally flat, fundamentally, of course, [mathematically] real, “Cartesian”, [54D spacetime with utmost universal metrics (cτ,X,Y,Z,ct), nonetheless QM in application in physical practice mostly is adequate to the reality.

That happens because of that really all – “space”, “time”, “spacetime”, as that rigorously scientifically proven in the philosophical 2007 Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s “The Information as Absolute” conception, recent version of the basic paper see

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363645560_The_Information_as_Absolute_-_2022_ed

- fundamentally cannot be impacted by anything in Matter, including in the spacetime fundamentally cannot be some “quantum fluctuations of spacetime geometry”. Correspondingly that

“…. The problem is that how to sample over spacetime geometries, that don’t satisfy Einstein’s equations isn’t known.…..”

- is correct, thank heaven even the mainstream scientists really didn’t solve this problem – besides too strange “solutions” as “string”, “brane”, “holographic universes”, etc., “theories” .

As to

“….. Is the mechanism of human consciousness, in its most fundamental form, based on the laws of fundamental particles that can interact with the world around it? Are there more hidden structures than what theoretical physicists see, causing human consciousness to interact with the world around them? Could these hidden structures be the same hidden world as predicted in the holographic theory of the world?….”

- in the SS&VT conception above it is rigorously proventhat informational systems “any consciousness”, including “consciousness on Earth” that every living being, including humans, have [more correctly – the consciousnesses have the living being organisms as residences],

- are fundamentally different systems, and so exist and operate basing on fundamentally different sets of basic laws/links/constants - and so in essentially different spaces, so the Matter’s laws/links/constants that govern existence and interactions of material objects are fundamentally non-applicable directly to consciousnesses’ existence and operation.

However consciousnesses, using some unknown – and fundamentally non-physical – energies well interact with at least very specific material structures; when, say, human consciousness evidently govern the practically material body. Nonetheless that has no any relation to the “QM observer problem”; all what happens in Matter, including at “wavefunctions collapses” in experimental instruments happens exclusively only in accordance with the objectively existent Matter’s laws/links/constants.

Cheers

ِDear André Michaud;

You may send this previous dialogue again, I think the sentences are a little messed up.

thank you

Seyed Mohammad Mousavi

Dear Seyed,

OK, I see what you mean. People occasionally mention to me that my sentences are too long to be comprehensible, which is due to a bad habit of mine of trying to correlate too many ideas in the same sentence, particularly on such wide ranging issues.

My last unclear answer was related to your specific question to me "What I mean by raising this question in the discussion is to understand at what level human consciousness has the possibility of interaction and influence on the laws and quantum functions of fundamental, atomic and subatomic particles?

What I meant, is that contrary to the view from the Copenhagen interpretation, that by "collapsing the wave function" that mathematically describes the non-localized momentary state of an elementary particle, as describable by the limited means of the wave function, we "suddenly cause it to physically become localized", which seems to imply that we are by this means interacting with physical reality, this is not the case.

"Collapsing the wave function" is just a mathematical means that we have to numerically calculate the momentary momentum energy and location of an electron with respect to its momentary distance from its atomic nucleus during its constant axial resonance oscillatory motion in an atomic orbital.

This belief that we control the sudden localization of elementary particles, on the part of people who accept the Copenhagen interpretation philosophy, by simply doing this calculation, eventually led to concepts such as the one that you mention in entry to your discussion:

" Many theoretical physicists mention the cosmic wave function, but the issue is that according to the laws of quantum mechanics, who is the observer of this wave function to collapse it into a universal special state? "

This last question would be well justified if the Copenhagen Interpretation made any logical sense.

But, doesn't simple common sense lead us to understand that it is not possible for any of us to simultaneously establish and then "collapse" the wave functions of all existing elementary particles of even our own body for it to physically exist in the continuous manner that we observe?

Let alone those of all elementary particles of the keyboards on which we are typing, for us to be able to type on, and screens that we are reading at this very moment, of our environment, of the skeletal remains of the dinosaurs that perished more than 65 million years ago?

It is reported that John Wheeler, one of the main advocates of the Copenhagen interpretation, believed that the universe blinked in and out of existence each time he blinked his eyes...

My answers were meant to bring to attention that our consciousness – or "awareness" as I prefer to describe it – does not give us control of physical reality. We actually can only "observe" physical reality, and draw conclusions about what we observe.

Note that not all physicists believe in the Copenhagen interpretation, far from it. They simply are the most vocal and most popular in discussions due to the attractiveness of this idea.

For example, when we glance around to look at our surrounding, we do not "cause" photons to enter our eyes, we simply cause our "retinas receptor cells" to be aligned with the trajectories of the incoming photons that are constantly coming from these various directions as a plenum due to the incalculable number of repeated emission of photons on account of the repeated energizing and de-energizing of electrons captive of their various orbitals in the atoms making up the surrounding objects.

Each of these photons that hit our receptor cells energize the transmission of a signal that propagates to the visual cortex – a 6-layer neural network – that automatically and constantly integrates the whole set of these signals into the resolved "visual images" that our "active consciousness" becomes aware of.

This integration is a fully automatic process which is a characteristic of neural networks operation that was discovered and analyzed by Donald Hebb in the 1940's, that has nothing to do with any collapsing of wave-functions.

All formal references to the discoveries made in neurophysiology over the past hundred years about the human neocortex and the manner in which its automatic correlating characteristics support our consciousness are synthesized in the article I provided, with direct links to those formal references that are available on the Internet.

Available for all who are interested in understanding what has been established up to now about our conceptual thinking ability.

Best Regards, André