No. How the proton and the neutron get their mass is known and doesn’t have anything to do with black holes and everything to do with the Standard Model. The Higgs field contributes partially to the mass of the proton and the neutron.

Nor is there any meaning to the qualifier ``primitive", when referring to protons and neutrons.

Stam Nicolis

Many thanks for the prompt answer. Theoretically I do not know what composes the primitive protons but I think these primitive protons are formed before the Planck wall. For me for example the primitive proton could have the same mass that the rest mass of the proton that we know today but a very different radius size. For example the size of the radius of the primitive proton could be very much inferior to the Planck length. I think the Planck length is appeared with the apparition of the Higgs. I think no one know precisely what was happened before the Planck wall. I could think that many things have been happened before the Planck wall. I think that the interaction of the Higgs field with the primitive protons have been puched the primitive protons to be entassed and then to form the proton that we know. In my model I usually work with the schwarzschild radius this formula gives me good results that is why I'm attached to this equation for the quantum world it makes me the things very clar and simple.

Jamil Kooli,

in my first book (Born:A universe , in my profile) I showed how the elementary particles can be created out of vacuum through a quantum mechanical process. It gives the right properties (mass, radius, spin g) of protons, electrons and neutrinos. No Higgs.

That was the starting point of the evolution of the universe.

“…For me protons and neutrons are black holes (their respective radius is this of Schwarzschild)...”

- protons and neutrons are some particles; and, as all other particles, have “sizes” ~ their Compton lengths, i.e. in tens of orders by magnitude larger than their “Schwarzschild” radius, though that

“Do you think the Higgs field acted to form the masses of black holes of protons and neutrons from primitive protons and primitive neutrons, resp.?”

- is really strange wording not only because of the above, but also in that so called “Higgs field”, even it really exists, really has no any relation to forming of any mass of any particle.

Particles are specific “4D helix-like” disturbances in the ultimate base of Matter – (at least) [5]4D dense lattice of primary elementary logical structures – (at least) [5]4D binary reversible fundamental logical elements [FLE]; the FLE-lattice is placed in the Matter’s corresponding utmost universal fundamentally absolute, fundamentally flat, and fundamentally “Cartesian”, (at least) [5]4D spacetime with metrics (at least) (cτ,X,Y,Z,ct).

The disturbances are created if some the lattice’s FLE is impacted with transmission to it some 4D momentum, P, [“bold” means 4D vector]; at that the FLE flips having some precession in the space with metrics (cτ,X,Y,Z), so in the lattice [and, of course in the spacetime] some cyclic sequential FLE flipping start to propagate – which is just a particle;

- which so moves in the lattice with the 4D speed of light, c, having momentum P=mc, and energy E=Pc= mc2, where “m” is just inertial mass.

Note at that the fundamental phenomena/notions, first of all in this case “Matter”– and so everything in Matter, i.e. “particles”, “fields”, etc., “Consciousness”, “Space”, “Time”, “Energy”, “Inertia”, “Information”, are fundamentally completely transcendent/uncertain/irrational, and so in the mainstream Standard Model such transcendent Higgs field effect is “discovered”;

- while the scientific definitions of these phenomena/notions can be, and are, scientifically defined only in framework of the philosophical 2007 Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s “The Information as Absolute” conception, recent version of the basic paper see

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363645560_The_Information_as_Absolute_-_2022_ed

- and more concretely in physics in the Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s informational physical model, in this case it is enough to read one paper

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/354418793_The_Informational_Conception_and_the_Base_of_Physics

Yet more concretely relating to “mass”: firstly note that since the absolutely fundamental phenomenon/notion “Change” is logically self-inconsistent, any continuous changes are fundamentally absolutely –i.e. logically – prohibited: at continuous changing the former, recent, and future changing states simultaneously exist, while all these states are different by definition, what is nonsense.

Correspondingly to overcome this prohibition at a change of something, including at creation of something, it is necessary to spend some “Energy”, while the corresponding resistance to change is “Inertia”. Matter is rather simple system that is based on a small set of a few fundamental universal logical links/constants, so energies and inertia in Matter have measures, for the last as that Newton proposed – as “inertial mass”, m.

Again, that happens at every interactions in Matter, which mostly happen at actions of the fundamental Nature Gravity, Weak, Electric, and Nuclear/Strong forces, which, in turn, are flows of the Forces’ mediators, and all that fundamentally doesn’t require some additional, so really strange, fields.

Pericles, again, are cyclic closed-loop sequences of precessing the lattice’s FLEs, so the corresponding disturbance in the lattice “FLE flip point” moves along some 4D “helix” the radius of a concrete particle helix [Compton length] is determined by the FLE precession angle, and minimal radius/Compton length so is the FLE size, which is equal to the Planck length, lP; so seems minimal cycle is “2π”lP, i.e. 6lP, that is Planck mass particle, the radius of which, besides, is its Schwarzschild radius, i.e. Planck mass particle is a “GR black hole”.

More see the linked above paper, more about what really Schwarzschild radius is see Shevchenko-Tokarevsky’s 2007 initial model of Gravity and Electric Forces in

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/366536729_The_informational_model_-Gravity_and_Electric_Forces_Version_2

Cheers

Hans Gennow

Sergey Shevchenko

Many thanks for the explanations and the ocumentation.

the denominations "primitive proton" and "primitive neutron" does not exist in physics. I called them so. For me primitive protons/ neutrons could be very smal particles compared to protons and neutrons. For me a primitiv proton could have a mass which is equal to the rest mass of the proton but a radius largely inferior to the planck length. A primitiv neutron could have a mass which is equal to the rest mass of the neutron but a radius largely inferior to the planck length. Me I suppose that the charges (+ and -) are principally the origin of every primitive masses. Primitive particles could also countain other things. A very big number (a sea) of primitiv protons could be in a proton. For me they form the black hole of a neutron. And the same thing for the neutron. For me the strong force is this of gravity in the quantum world. I think Higgs acts partially to make particle having masses.

Sorry, an error occurred in my answer just above.

it figures in "A very big number (a sea) of primitiv protons could be in a proton. For me they form the black hole of a NEUTRON".

The correction is "A very big number (a sea) of primitiv protons could be in a proton. For me they form the black hole of a PROTON."